Community Chat

[Lila Belle]

The mods thought the word my brother was called by some was too ugly to post @SydneyH.

I'm glad they're more respectful than some people have been. BTW, he's a Colonel in the US Army, as of last Wednesday.

[Irshgrl31201]

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@itiswhatitis wrote:

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@Irshgrl31201 wrote:

Children/Young Adults (American citizens) have to be told in 2016 why people are still mean, short sighted and racist?  Wonder why?  If you were a minority facing a multitude of social and economic issues in this country you might not feel the way you do.  You likely are not (given your handle) so you would never understand it.  It can be hurtful to be considered one of the less desirable and then be mocked for it.

Counseling is a bad thing?  Of course not.  Is counseling for drug addiction a good thing?  Yes.  Is counseling in any form or shape a bad thing?  Likely not.  Why does it disturb someone like you that some people want and need counseling @Irshgrl31201.

I am back and I would like to comment on this. You have no idea what I am or am not or what I have been through. I happen to have a daughter who is black and I faced many ignorant racists in the town I lived while dating and living with her father and raising her as a single mother. Really angry people. As long as people in this world are different whether that be skin tone, religion, culture, there will always be hate and racism. That is just a fact. We may grow as a culture and not see such extreme examples, but it will always exist and that is just a fact. I have raised my daughter with the common sense to know that those who dislike her because of her race has nothing to do with her and it is their ignorance and cowardice, nothing at all to do with her. We have free speech in this country and that even protects hate speech to some extent so I find it disturbing that someone who is college age would need to be counseled over a Halloween costume they found offensive.

Someone like you? If I was easily offended I would need counseling for that statement. It doesn't disturb me, I find it ridiculous that someone would need counseling over a Halloween costume. As a business owner I certainly wouldn't hire someone so unstable and sensitive to ever work for me because they would be complaining over every imagined and even real slights that people deal with everyday without having a meltdown. I can't even imagine someone so sensitive out in the workforce, at least not without a HR file 3 inches thick and having to take more mental health days than days actually worked. 

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I still don't know why it bothers you so much!  @Irshgrl31201.  You've not given a logical explanation for why you are so against this particular form of counseling vs. any other form of counseling.  When you can give me that, then I will see your aversion to it for what it is.  Right now, your up in their air attitude about it and I'd like to know why.

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I have never said it bothered me. NEVER. I never said they shouldn't be counseled, NEVER.  I find it absolutely ridiculous but if someone needs to be counseled over a costume, have at it. I do worry about a generation of kids so sensitive to a costume and trying to shut others up who offer an alternative (Yale professors) opinion that they disagree with that they would try to get them fired. I can see where they get it though. Again, after seeing your prior posts and you going off on several posters, I think maybe you can come back when you are not hysterical. 

[mistriTsquirrel]

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@Mominohio wrote:

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@SeaMaiden wrote:

It just seems like more and more the criminal is getting more rights than the victims anymore.....due to political correctness or whatever.....soon, drug dealers will be called business entrepreneurs.....

I found this quote and it says it says exactly how I feel about referring to ex convicts  as felons:

“It helps people make important decisions about hiring, about renting, about associating with people who have shown a proclivity to break the law,” he said. “Shame is not a bad thing. It’s helped civilization rise. And people who cannot be trusted, who have committed violent crimes in the past, there’s nothing wrong with calling them exactly what they are – and that is felons.”

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@SeaMaiden

The highlighted sentence above is no longer politically correct, or seen as a proper tool in raising children. And it is one major reason why we are where we are today.

People used to have some shame. You were raised to understand what it was, to feel it at some point (usually when your parents pointed out bad behavior and taught you to be ashamed of it) when you did wrong or made bad decisions, and was a valuable tool in learning right from wrong.

I just finished raising a son (now 20) and so many parents today would never shame a child or allow them to feel it. I always believed ( and still do) that the best way to learn things is to experience them. At some point we got away from holding people responsible for their actions, and away from pride in themselves and their good deeds/actions, and shame in their bad ones.

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@Mominohio

I'm not sure that shame--in and of itself--is necessarily the best way to do things.  I think there's a way to punish people by saying, "this is what you did that's unacceptable, and this is the consequence."

Shame may be a byproduct of that, but you aren't calling the person worthless when you're doing that.  A child needs to know that an action won't be tolerated, but if/when you make him feel like a piece of garbage, he will begin to feel hopeless and like nothing he does--good or bad--matters.  That's a problem.

These things need to be approached in a more rational manner, not a manner based on emotions.  When the person associates a bad behavior with a bad consequence, but does not see himself as a waste of a life just because he did something bad, he is more likely to see a reason to redeem himself.  If he thinks he's just garbage and having constructive goals and aspirations is a hopeless pipe dream, he has no incentive to stop the bad behavior.

[Lila Belle]

The word is racism @Irshgrl31201.

Have you ever wondered how your child, like my brother, was spoken about behind her back?

[mistriTsquirrel]

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@software wrote:

I'm an "individual" and I have nothing in common with a felon.

The best rehab for a felon is to own up & be accountable for exactly what they are - convicts, criminals & felons.   Then move forward.

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@software

You may have a lot in common with a felon.  Felons often have families and friends.  They have physical bodies that become ill, just like yours.  They have to eat food, breathe air and sleep in order to survive, etc.

The problem with saying "move forward," is that it isn't that simple.  Most felons have difficulty obtaining jobs that pay enough money for them to support themselves, so they resort to old behaviors to get what they need in order to live.

Even the most well-meaning ex-con has the odds stacked against him/her. 

Something has to be done to make it possible for people to exist lawfully after they've had a felony conviction...or else we'll all suffer the consequences (as a society).

[itiswhatitis]

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@mistriTsquirrel wrote:

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@Mominohio wrote:

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@SeaMaiden wrote:

It just seems like more and more the criminal is getting more rights than the victims anymore.....due to political correctness or whatever.....soon, drug dealers will be called business entrepreneurs.....

I found this quote and it says it says exactly how I feel about referring to ex convicts  as felons:

“It helps people make important decisions about hiring, about renting, about associating with people who have shown a proclivity to break the law,” he said. “Shame is not a bad thing. It’s helped civilization rise. And people who cannot be trusted, who have committed violent crimes in the past, there’s nothing wrong with calling them exactly what they are – and that is felons.”

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@SeaMaiden

The highlighted sentence above is no longer politically correct, or seen as a proper tool in raising children. And it is one major reason why we are where we are today.

People used to have some shame. You were raised to understand what it was, to feel it at some point (usually when your parents pointed out bad behavior and taught you to be ashamed of it) when you did wrong or made bad decisions, and was a valuable tool in learning right from wrong.

I just finished raising a son (now 20) and so many parents today would never shame a child or allow them to feel it. I always believed ( and still do) that the best way to learn things is to experience them. At some point we got away from holding people responsible for their actions, and away from pride in themselves and their good deeds/actions, and shame in their bad ones.

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@Mominohio

I'm not sure that shame--in and of itself--is necessarily the best way to do things.  I think there's a way to punish people by saying, "this is what you did that's unacceptable, and this is the consequence."

Shame may be a byproduct of that, but you aren't calling the person worthless when you're doing that.  A child needs to know that an action won't be tolerated, but if/when you make him feel like a piece of garbage, he will begin to feel hopeless and like nothing he does--good or bad--matters.  That's a problem.

These things need to be approached in a more rational manner, not a manner based on emotions.  When the person associates a bad behavior with a bad consequence, but does not see himself as a waste of a life just because he did something bad, he is more likely to see a reason to redeem himself.  If he thinks he's just garbage and having constructive goals and aspirations is a hopeless pipe dream, he has no incentive to stop the bad behavior.

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@mistriTsquirrel, excellent.  I like to talk to a problem not at the problem! 

I think if we stop with our knee jerk reaction to things sometimes we could all understand one another a little better.  Look at it from all angles. 

[Irshgrl31201]

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@Lila Belle wrote:
The word is racism @Irshgrl31201.

Have you ever wondered how your child, like my brother, was spoken about behind her back?

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I haven't had to wonder, it has been said right to her face. Like I said, we cannot control what ignorant and fearful people do but we can control what we do. She knows what they say, says more about them and their lack of intelligence and has nothing to do with her. She also grew up where some in the white community were haters because she was black and some in the black community were haters because she was white.

[Lila Belle]

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@Irshgrl31201 wrote:

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@Lila Belle wrote:
The word is racism @Irshgrl31201.

Have you ever wondered how your child, like my brother, was spoken about behind her back?

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I haven't had to wonder, it has been said right to her face. Like I said, we cannot control what ignorant and fearful people do but we can control what we do. She knows what they say, says more about them and their lack of intelligence and has nothing to do with her.

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@Irshgrl31201 wrote:

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@Lila Belle wrote:
The word is racism @Irshgrl31201.

Have you ever wondered how your child, like my brother, was spoken about behind her back?

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I haven't had to wonder, it has been said right to her face. Like I said, we cannot control what ignorant and fearful people do but we can control what we do. She knows what they say, says more about them and their lack of intelligence and has nothing to do with her.

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Then you should know better.

Good night to you.

[mistriTsquirrel]

@itiswhatitis

I see the topic of behavior modification as something that requires more thought and less emotion.

It makes sense that emotion will occur when crimes and other bad acts occur, but we should not have a system that promotes emotion as a reason for a particular punishment.