Community Chat

[jubilant]

On 1/23/2015 Cakers1 said:

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

Raven, I totally agree with you that we have so many disconnected young people today. Many churches around where I live are reaching out to them and renting out buildings and inviting all kids from the community to come in and have fun and try to connect them with something. My daughter will be working with horses and kids who have problems when she graduates and gets her degree. She will be working for a charity....hopefully with some of these kids and being able to help them. Some of them come out to the barns just to be with the horses and work in the cold...no boots...no gloves...I would like to see more work ranches and farms for these kids <em>instead of just setting across a desk from a counselor</em>. <em>We need programs to get the interested in something. I think working with animals is a great way to go. I think it has been successful with prisoners.</em>

jubilant: I agree 100%. And all the best to your daughter - she sounds like a wonderful person.

Thank you, Cakers. She is wonderful to me! She has a heart and compassion for people.

[raven-blackbird]

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

On 1/23/2015 raven-blackbird said:

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

Raven, I totally agree with you that we have so many disconnected young people today. Many churches around where I live are reaching out to them and renting out buildings and inviting all kids from the community to come in and have fun and try to connect them with something. My daughter will be working with horses and kids who have problems when she graduates and gets her degree. She will be working for a charity....hopefully with some of these kids and being able to help them. Some of them come out to the barns just to be with the horses and work in the cold...no boots...no gloves...I would like to see more work ranches and farms for these kids instead of just setting across a desk from a counselor. We need programs to get the interested in something. I think working with animals is a great way to go. I think it has been successful with prisoners.

I think that's a EXCELLENT thing she is doing...........and I so agree that for kids/teens, connecting with a horse, dog, any animal can be the first step, bridge, to connecting with others.......it's a tried and true method...........best wishes to her and her endeavors.........need more like her................................................raven

Thank you, Raven. I was raised in the city. Mom and Dad opened our house up to the "hoods" as we called them back then. There were a few rules that had to be set. We played ping pong and had snacks and mom made them listen to a short devotion. One time we took them to church on Sunday and there the whole back pew was....lined up with black leather jackets!!!! About six of them. Dad told them they could not come back if they showed up drunk....after all he had two teen daughters. One passed out at our kitchen table. Dad and the other guys carried him out and took him home. He was not allowed back in. If he had been it would have ruined it for everyone and they would have had to stop our fun Ping-Pong nights and all the other kids would have been back on the streets. Sometimes you just do all you can do and that is all you can do. Sometimes one apple can spoil the whole barrel....and ruin things for everyone....the Bible speaks of that very thing in the New Testament. Even so we are still to love them and pray for them. I hate to say this....but prison changes some people. Hopefully we will come up with more ideas for these kids before it gets to that point where they are dangerous. That is why your son is a policeman...he enforces the law and protects innocent people and a pastor is considered the shepherd of his flock. A shepherd protects his flock.

your dad was a good man..............he saw the value in what others failed to see..........on that shepherd...........even the shepherd goes out and looks for the lost sheep, even if they keep wandering off...........................................raven

[jubilant]

On 1/23/2015 raven-blackbird said:

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

On 1/23/2015 raven-blackbird said:

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

Raven, I totally agree with you that we have so many disconnected young people today. Many churches around where I live are reaching out to them and renting out buildings and inviting all kids from the community to come in and have fun and try to connect them with something. My daughter will be working with horses and kids who have problems when she graduates and gets her degree. She will be working for a charity....hopefully with some of these kids and being able to help them. Some of them come out to the barns just to be with the horses and work in the cold...no boots...no gloves...I would like to see more work ranches and farms for these kids instead of just setting across a desk from a counselor. We need programs to get the interested in something. I think working with animals is a great way to go. I think it has been successful with prisoners.

I think that's a EXCELLENT thing she is doing...........and I so agree that for kids/teens, connecting with a horse, dog, any animal can be the first step, bridge, to connecting with others.......it's a tried and true method...........best wishes to her and her endeavors.........need more like her................................................raven

Thank you, Raven. I was raised in the city. Mom and Dad opened our house up to the "hoods" as we called them back then. There were a few rules that had to be set. We played ping pong and had snacks and mom made them listen to a short devotion. One time we took them to church on Sunday and there the whole back pew was....lined up with black leather jackets!!!! About six of them. Dad told them they could not come back if they showed up drunk....after all he had two teen daughters. One passed out at our kitchen table. Dad and the other guys carried him out and took him home. He was not allowed back in. If he had been it would have ruined it for everyone and they would have had to stop our fun Ping-Pong nights and all the other kids would have been back on the streets. Sometimes you just do all you can do and that is all you can do. Sometimes one apple can spoil the whole barrel....and ruin things for everyone....the Bible speaks of that very thing in the New Testament. Even so we are still to love them and pray for them. I hate to say this....but prison changes some people. Hopefully we will come up with more ideas for these kids before it gets to that point where they are dangerous. That is why your son is a policeman...he enforces the law and protects innocent people and a pastor is considered the shepherd of his flock. A shepherd protects his flock.

your dad was a good man..............he saw the value in what others failed to see..........on that shepherd...........even the shepherd goes out and looks for the lost sheep, even if they keep wandering off...........................................raven

You got me there! I see you know the story of the 90 and 9. If that sheep keeps it up...a lion will get it. Some sheep are just darn stubborn. These days so many sheep are wandering away and it seems there are not enough shepherds. We all have to take responsibility for that and do what we can. Too many people rely on their pastor, priest, leader, rabbi....whatever....and they burn out. They are only human.

[feline groovy]

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

Raven, I totally agree with you that we have so many disconnected young people today. Many churches around where I live are reaching out to them and renting out buildings and inviting all kids from the community to come in and have fun and try to connect them with something. My daughter will be working with horses and kids who have problems when she graduates and gets her degree. She will be working for a charity....hopefully with some of these kids and being able to help them. Some of them come out to the barns just to be with the horses and work in the cold...no boots...no gloves...I would like to see more work ranches and farms for these kids instead of just setting across a desk from a counselor. We need programs to get the interested in something. I think working with animals is a great way to go. I think it has been successful with prisoners.

* Equine therapy... Animals and children share a magical bond.

*

[Puzzle Piece]

On 1/23/2015 NoelSeven said:

Wow, somewhat off subject but not, just saw a new report on the Zodiac Killer. Remember that from decades ago?

They may know who he his now, a son is identifying his father as the killer and has produced his fingerprint. The fingerprint includes an abnormality also found on a print of the Zodiac Killer.

I'm going to keep on top of this one, I was really young when it happened but I remember it well. People were afraid to go outside of their homes and it has consumed SF police detectives for decades!

I remember the killer as well. Terrorized us all. It would be great if they finally caught the coward.

[terrier3]

On 1/23/2015 mstyrion 1 said:

On 1/23/2015 minkbunny said:

I have always found Noel's posts filled with clarity.

I have often found your posts, Raven, filled with confusion and hyperbole

I completely agree regarding Noel's posts. She is informed and well written.

I often learn something new from what she writes.

Raven, you know it's possible to debate and discuss without resorting to personal attack. Not everyone has to agree with you nor do you have to agree with them. It's sharing ideas and it is a chance to even learn something.

Noel presents facts...she doesn't attack people personally.

If people are intimidated by her or feel "attacked" - maybe they just are arguing a point that is devoid of facts and feel they have no rational comeback.

[Mominohio]

There has always been a certain percentage of any generation, that when young, think they know better, want to buck the system, feel lost and misunderstood. The problem is that as the generations progress, the one's that are excessively radical, are getting more aggressive, and more dangerous. These that are siding with terrorist ideologies are just the latest, most dangerous version of the "rebellious youth".

Is there a component of mental illness? Possibly. But more, there is what several here have hit upon, a disconnect. They don't connect with anything good or positive. Some can be helped, by being involved in something bigger than they are. Some will not be. It is not the fault of the generations before them. It is not the responsibility of a group like a church, when offering their fellowship doesn't help, to be subjected to this person's danger, whether it comes from mental illness or from stupidity and weakness.

People who don't want to be 'helped' won't be. If they prove to be a danger, and she is, they will have to be removed from society, however that has to happen. Seems like she had had a lot of interaction with people who tried to steer her in another direction, and she is having none of it, so what else can anyone reasonably expect. She is sealing her own fate.

To me, she is no different than the heavy smoker who's family has begged them to stop, who's doctor's have repeatedly explained the disease and death that is likely to come from their behavior. They know what they are doing, they know what the results of their actions may well be, but they CHOOSE to continue doing what they are doing.

Hopefully she will be stopped, before she brings harm to innocent people.

[jubilant]

On 1/24/2015 mominohio said:

There has always been a certain percentage of any generation, that when young, think they know better, want to buck the system, feel lost and misunderstood. The problem is that as the generations progress, the one's that are excessively radical, are getting more aggressive, and more dangerous. These that are siding with terrorist ideologies are just the latest, most dangerous version of the "rebellious youth".

Is there a component of mental illness? Possibly. But more, there is what several here have hit upon, a disconnect. They don't connect with anything good or positive. Some can be helped, by being involved in something bigger than they are. Some will not be. It is not the fault of the generations before them. It is not the responsibility of a group like a church, when offering their fellowship doesn't help, to be subjected to this person's danger, whether it comes from mental illness or from stupidity and weakness.

People who don't want to be 'helped' won't be. If they prove to be a danger, and she is, they will have to be removed from society, however that has to happen. Seems like she had had a lot of interaction with people who tried to steer her in another direction, and she is having none of it, so what else can anyone reasonably expect. She is sealing her own fate.

To me, she is no different than the heavy smoker who's family has begged them to stop, who's doctor's have repeatedly explained the disease and death that is likely to come from their behavior. They know what they are doing, they know what the results of their actions may well be, but they CHOOSE to continue doing what they are doing.

Hopefully she will be stopped, before she brings harm to innocent people.

This is a great post. While I see both sides of the generation debate, I feel if someone is mentally competent then they are accountable for their actions. Somewhere there has to be a line drawn. While I have my own opinions of where the generations have failed...that would take a book so I won't go there. I did think Raven posted this out of a hearts desire to see more done to help these kids and whether or not we agree with each other we need to show respect for each others feelings. I say this as someone who has stuck her foot in her mouth more than once. Reading over this again makes me a bit uncomfortable....especially when you really like all of the people involved in this conversation. It did bring attention to an important subject though and that is a good thing.

[minkbunny]

Morning, jubilant

I think what any generation can do to best serve their children is to get those truly needing medical help whatever assistance they can -

barring that rare circumstance, to teach their offspring that they will be held responsible for their actions. They will not be able to blame their parents, their country, the "system", their teachers, their church, they will own their actions and be held wholly accountable for them.

[sidsmom]

On 1/23/2015 feline groovy said:

On 1/23/2015 jubilant said:

Raven, I totally agree with you that we have so many disconnected young people today. Many churches around where I live are reaching out to them and renting out buildings and inviting all kids from the community to come in and have fun and try to connect them with something. My daughter will be working with horses and kids who have problems when she graduates and gets her degree. She will be working for a charity....hopefully with some of these kids and being able to help them. Some of them come out to the barns just to be with the horses and work in the cold...no boots...no gloves...I would like to see more work ranches and farms for these kids instead of just setting across a desk from a counselor. We need programs to get the interested in something. I think working with animals is a great way to go. I think it has been successful with prisoners.

* Equine therapy... Animals and children share a magical bond.

*

Another successful program is Transcendental Meditation. Most people will think it's too 'hippy' & don't understand it since it's something you can't touch or see.

The David Lynch Foundation has introduced TM to veterans w/ PTSD, children in poverish schools & abused women/children...and there are positive results. And TM is a skill that will remain w/ them for a lifetime. Once a calm mind, things are clearer.