Community Chat

[Tinkrbl44]

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@itiswhatitis wrote:

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@hckynut wrote:

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@esmeraldagooch wrote:

There are others also.

@esmeraldagooch

Your graph was a perfect illustration of what is called:

Capitalism---Free Market Enterprise

That is exactly why the United States is called a free country. I told my story about The Bell System declared to be a Monopoly by 1 Judge Green back in 1984. Cost thousands of workers their jobs, and was the sole reason that after working for that same company for 33 years, I retired a Full Pay Grade Lower than when I started.

Unless someone with billions of $$$ wants to compete with Mylan, and risks losing maybe hundreds of millions of their own $$$, the free market is working.

Did I like it when just 1 man, Judge Green, changed the name of the company for which I had worked from Western Electric to AT&T? It wasn't only the name that changed that damaged me. At that time I had worked for the company for over 25 years. And what happened?  I lost 2 pay grades,/went to a harder job/had to work many weekends at straight time, and lost all those higher pay grades $$$ for the next 8 years until I retired.

Overall that cost me, before I retired, over $70,000. Then retiring at a lower pay grade? Well over $9,000 to $10,000 every year of my retirement, which is now over 25 years, or close to a quarter of a million $$$.

If and/ or until another Judge Green comes along and declares Mylan a monopoly?  That again is how our USA Capitalism works.

hckynut(john)

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Thanks for the lesson.  The United States is a Republic which has a dual economy.  Don't forget the Socialist aspect.  A what point (if any) should "the free market" be regulated to the degree we put caps on the cost of drugs?

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@itiswhatitis

I don't think anyone needs to put a cap on drug costs.    

HOWEVER .....  I do think it makes more sense for a company to get approval to raise costs ..... they must provide documentation  of cost to manufacture and circumstances that justifies the new proposed rate increases.  

That way, a product that costs $3 to manufacture would never reach the market at $600 a pop.   

[hckynut]

@itiswhatitis

Until there is someone or group of them, willing to risk a lot of their money, knowing that others have failed?  Mylan should be able to charge whatever they choose for their prices because they own the patent and appears to have no competitors.

I think there are more federal regulations that already make starting or operating small businesses hard enough. What? Make federal regulations that apply only to Mylan, or every company the feds think charge too much for their products.

Last I looked, in your reference to Republic, our cic and those in the 2 other branches of our government, were elected "by the people". Maybe you know something I don't about that comment of mine.

Socialist aspect? Again, you must know and/or see things I am not knowing nor seeing. I shared my story about a "monopoly", and how 1 man effected my life, along with tens of thousands of others. 

More fed regulations on companies? I say there are thousands too many now. Get everyone to beat the drum to find competitors to Mylan, or maybe see if Judge Green is still with us. There has to be at least 1 more Judge Green like among those that see Mylan as a monopoly. Get her/him to act.

hckynut(john)

[itiswhatitis]

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@Tinkrbl44 wrote:

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@itiswhatitis wrote:

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@hckynut wrote:

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@esmeraldagooch wrote:

There are others also.

@esmeraldagooch

Your graph was a perfect illustration of what is called:

Capitalism---Free Market Enterprise

That is exactly why the United States is called a free country. I told my story about The Bell System declared to be a Monopoly by 1 Judge Green back in 1984. Cost thousands of workers their jobs, and was the sole reason that after working for that same company for 33 years, I retired a Full Pay Grade Lower than when I started.

Unless someone with billions of $$$ wants to compete with Mylan, and risks losing maybe hundreds of millions of their own $$$, the free market is working.

Did I like it when just 1 man, Judge Green, changed the name of the company for which I had worked from Western Electric to AT&T? It wasn't only the name that changed that damaged me. At that time I had worked for the company for over 25 years. And what happened?  I lost 2 pay grades,/went to a harder job/had to work many weekends at straight time, and lost all those higher pay grades $$$ for the next 8 years until I retired.

Overall that cost me, before I retired, over $70,000. Then retiring at a lower pay grade? Well over $9,000 to $10,000 every year of my retirement, which is now over 25 years, or close to a quarter of a million $$$.

If and/ or until another Judge Green comes along and declares Mylan a monopoly?  That again is how our USA Capitalism works.

hckynut(john)

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Thanks for the lesson.  The United States is a Republic which has a dual economy.  Don't forget the Socialist aspect.  A what point (if any) should "the free market" be regulated to the degree we put caps on the cost of drugs?

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@itiswhatitis

I don't think anyone needs to put a cap on drug costs.    

HOWEVER .....  I do think it makes more sense for a company to get approval to raise costs ..... they must provide documentation  of cost to manufacture and circumstances that justifies the new proposed rate increases.  

That way, a product that costs $3 to manufacture would never reach the market at $600 a pop.   

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I was asking @hckynut.  He was so nice to tell us what "Capitalism" in the US is.

[Tinkrbl44]

@hckynut

I wish I knew what variables these pens had.   People keep saying that Mylan has the patent ... but so what?  

In addition to the AdrenaClick pen,  Enbrel has the Sureclick injector .... today I saw a tv commercial for a diabetic drug Trujillo (sp?) and there are several others. These injector pens are all over the place!

[itiswhatitis]

@hckynut

@itiswhatitis

Until there is someone or group of them, willing to risk a lot of their money, knowing that others have failed?  Mylan should be able to charge whatever they choose for their prices because they own the patent and appears to have no competitors.

IT WAS JUST A QUESTION.

I think there are more federal regulations that already make starting or operating small businesses hard enough. What? Make federal regulations that apply only to Mylan, or every company the feds think charge too much for their products.

YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO YOUR OPINION.  I'VE SEE SOME POST THAT WOULD SAY THE PRICE SHOULD BE REGULATED AND CAPS PUT ON DRUGS.  I'M SURE YOU'VE READ THEM.  I DIDN'T SAY I AGREE WITH THAT.  NOWHERE HAVE I SAID THAT.

Last I looked, in your reference to Republic, our cic and those in the 2 other branches of our government, were elected "by the people". Maybe you know something I don't about that comment of mine.

THEY ARE NOT BRANCHES OF GOVERNMENT.  IT IS HOW OUR COUNTRY OPERATES.  WE HAVE A DUAL ECONOMY.  ONE WHERE THE FREE MARKET AND SOCIALISM IS PART OF IT.

YOU'LL NEED TO SETTLE YOURSELF ON THAT BECAUSE IT IS WHAT IT IS.

Socialist aspect? Again, you must know and/or see things I am not knowing nor seeing. I shared my story about a "monopoly", and how 1 man effected my life, along with tens of thousands of others. 

YES, ASIDE FROM THE FREE MARKET CAPITALIST MODEL WE ALSO HAVE THE SOCIALIST MODEL.  OUR REPUBLIC IS NOT A FULL ON SOCIALIST COUNTRY BUT WE DO HAVE SOME ASPECTS OF IT.  YOU'LL NEED TO SETTLE YOURSELF WITH THAT AS WELL, BECAUSE THAT'S THE WAY IT IS.  ARE YOU UNDER THE IMPRESSION WE ARE A DEMOCRACY?  WE ARE A REPUBLIC WITH DEMOCRACY AS A FORM OF GOVERNMENT.

More fed regulations on companies? I say there are thousands too many now. Get everyone to beat the drum to find competitors to Mylan, or maybe see if Judge Green is still with us. There has to be at least 1 more Judge Green like among those that see Mylan as a monopoly. Get her/him to act.

I ASKED A QUESTION.  I MADE NO INFERENCES ABOUT WHAT SHOULD BE DONE.

hckynut(john)

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[Stray]

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@ValuSkr wrote:

@Deanie  I don't know either Sen. Manchin or his daughter.   But I think he's well-regarded and doubt he raised her to be selfish and greedy.  Hence, my wondering if he appealed to her better nature -- small though it may be (like the Grinch's heart!).

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@ValuSkr- he is a pretty decent guy....maybe the daughter is just not like her Dad...don't know 

[Stray]

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@esmeraldagooch wrote:

There are others also.

@esmeraldagooch- as a nurse, I used the ampules but I am a nurse.  The problem with the ampule is that it is multiple dose and in an emergency under duress, a larger dose can be drawn up and kill someone, especially a child.  There is also the matter of contamination because it is open at the top not like a vial which has a seal...so a lay person may inadvertently contaminate the vial.  It's different if the injection is routine but it is an emergency medication.  It is a solution but not a good substitute for the pen which is fast, clean and exact.  I am glad the generic will be available 

[momtochloe]

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@Stray wrote:

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@esmeraldagooch wrote:

There are others also.

@esmeraldagooch- as a nurse, I used the ampules but I am a nurse.  The problem with the ampule is that it is multiple dose and in an emergency under duress, a larger dose can be drawn up and kill someone, especially a child.  There is also the matter of contamination because it is open at the top not like a vial which has a seal...so a lay person may inadvertently contaminate the vial.  It's different if the injection is routine but it is an emergency medication.  It is a solution but not a good substitute for the pen which is fast, clean and exact.  I am glad the generic will be available 

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I just want to say one thing.  I took care of my diabetic mother for a long time and staying on a diabetic menu was not high on her list of things to do.  I did everything I could to try and keep her on track but there did come a time when I was faced with having to inject her with insulin which completely freaked me out.  I made my peace with other medical procedures throughout the years but that one shoved me over the edge.

Luckily, Januvia was introduced around the same time and saved me from having to do actual injections which I cannot even begin to tell you how much I appreciated it as the thought of having to inject a person with lifesaving medicine in an acute situation like an allergic reaction is beyond comprehension for me.  It took me months to get used to testing my mom's blood sugar every day but having to react to a medical emergency like that is beyond the pale.  

These Epi-Pens literally save lives.  They should not be priced to be unreachable to any person that literally needs lifesaving help.

[hckynut]

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@Tinkrbl44 wrote:

@hckynut

I wish I knew what variables these pens had.   People keep saying that Mylan has the patent ... but so what?  

In addition to the AdrenaClick pen,  Enbrel has the Sureclick injector .... today I saw a tv commercial for a diabetic drug Trujillo (sp?) and there are several others. These injector pens are all over the place!

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@Tinkrbl44

All I know is what I have heard and read. That being, that several have tried to compete with the Epi-pen, unsuccessfully. Why? There must be something in the patent that they were not able to successfully recreate. I don't really know the why.

Sure, I think the prices are ridiculous, but at what point do fed regulations end and the Free Market begin? I watched a documentary that showed the stack of new regulations, just implemented in 2015, that looked like it was at least 3' high.

I have also known 2 of my friends planned on starting a small business Once they got started and were making headway? Here come the County Regulators/City Regulators, not even the feds!

After seeing many of the useless and ridiculous regulations they would have to pass? Even though at that point they had invested many thousands of their dollars, they said "enough is enough".

Fortunately they both were licensed journeyman in different trades and they had no problem finding jobs. Guess that's it here for me for now.

hckynut(john)

[Stray]

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@Tinkrbl44 wrote:

@hckynut

I wish I knew what variables these pens had.   People keep saying that Mylan has the patent ... but so what?  

In addition to the AdrenaClick pen,  Enbrel has the Sureclick injector .... today I saw a tv commercial for a diabetic drug Trujillo (sp?) and there are several others. These injector pens are all over the place!

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@Tinkrbl44- all the pens don't work the same and would have to be adapted to the particular drug and titrated accordingly; it is not a solution that can be done quickly...ie insulin works with units, epinephrine Ccs.  Each pen is designed to work with a particular drug. 

With adrenaclick, the problem is supply and demand; they don't produce as many.  Also, insurance companies cover the Epi pen but may not for adrenaclick; each company has their own formulary and tier level.  The adrenaclick works slightly different than an Epi pen and the child and family must by law be reeducated in administration, which is the easiest barrier to overcome.  However, It is a good solution to the shortage.