Community Chat

[terrier3]

On 6/14/2014 Junebug54 said:

So why have 7 kids if you can't take care of them?

Maybe things were better before her husband died 3 years ago?

Maybe she is a devout Catholic and doesn't use BC -and chooses life over termination?

Maybe she is illiterate, bi-polar and doesn't speak English and was overwhelmed by the whole legal system?

Now WE have to care for her 7 kids...instead of intervening earlier with solutions instead of unfairly administered punishment.

[Marp2]

It seems some are implying one should not have children until they have enough money on hand to raise them to age 18, you know, just in case something doesn't go as planned like sickness, injury or death. The current cost is estimated to be between $200,000 and $250,000 per healthy child.

Maybe if we made that a law, along with a requirement that the money be put in a trust fund, it would be an even better population control method than abstinence and would certainly eliminate the horrific problem of poor people having children.

[herekitty_kitty]

On 6/14/2014 Marp2 said:

It seems some are implying one should not have children until they have enough money on hand to raise them to age 18, you know, just in case something doesn't go as planned like sickness, injury or death. The current cost is estimated to be between $200,000 and $250,000 per healthy child.

Maybe if we made that a law, along with a requirement that the money be put in a trust fund, it would be an even better population control method than abstinence and would certainly eliminate the horrific problem of poor people having children.

we all know that will never happen. hey if she is catholic let the church take care of children. God gave man and woman a brain for them to think for themselves. as so many like to say around here we aren't living in the dark ages.

[kittymomNC]

On 6/14/2014 herekitty_kitty said:

On 6/14/2014 terrier3 said:

I don't see how fining parents will solve this problem.

PA jails many people for other strange fines. One guy was jailed for catching a large mouth bass during small mouth bass season.

In my county in NY, a woman was jailed for having two overdue library books. She had been stopped for having a taillight out and when the police found the warrant for her arrest, she offered to pay for the books - $85 total (including fines). The police told her it was too late to pay and she was brought to jail. They denied her insulin, even though she complained, and she had a stroke. She is now suing.

It costs MORE money to process these people owing civil fines, jail them, etc.

Then they have to deal with being criminals...who wants to hire people who served time in jail, even if it was only for a few days?

It affects poor people much more often and is a waste of time & money, IMO.

"Patton said he has lost sleep over her death. At the same time, he acknowledged that a short jail stint can sometimes "break the habit" of parents who'd rather party into the night than take their children to school the next day. The county started a program a few years ago that gives families 30 to 60 days to keep daily logs of each class and assignment. He estimated that the district truancy rate had dropped more than 30 percent."

if they don't want to be an active parent they shouldn't have children. the woman was living off the government. she was a stay at home mom. the least she could have done was be an active parent. stop blaming the court system. she put her self there.

LOL the system failed her? the system didn't make her have 7 kids. they didn't hold her down and say "you will have 7 children!" she shouldn't have had so many children. that's on her.

Apparently you must know nothing about bi-polar disorder...maybe it would be good to educate yourself about something before you make these kinds of statements. There are different levels of bi-polar disorder, and it can be very difficult for a person to live anything close to a normal life if they have a severe form of it. It's like other mental illnesses...even if she had been prescribed medication for it, it doesn't always help, and the people who suffer, and yes, I said SUFFER, from this disease don't always remember or are unable to take their medications for various reasons related to the illness.

It's a sad state of affairs that there is still a stigma attached to mental illness, and people would rather ignore it than try to understand it. Yes, I do think that the "system", whatever system it was, social services, the courts, the doctors, whatever, let her AND her children down. This should never have happened, but it also should not be blamed solely on this woman.

[nun ya]

Lack of parenting in part. I have mixed feeling about this.

But I can tell you, if my Mother was ever threatened to be fined for me not going to school, you can bet your last nickel, I'd be in school.

[herekitty_kitty]

On 6/14/2014 kittymomNC said:

On 6/14/2014 herekitty_kitty said:

On 6/14/2014 terrier3 said:

I don't see how fining parents will solve this problem.

PA jails many people for other strange fines. One guy was jailed for catching a large mouth bass during small mouth bass season.

In my county in NY, a woman was jailed for having two overdue library books. She had been stopped for having a taillight out and when the police found the warrant for her arrest, she offered to pay for the books - $85 total (including fines). The police told her it was too late to pay and she was brought to jail. They denied her insulin, even though she complained, and she had a stroke. She is now suing.

It costs MORE money to process these people owing civil fines, jail them, etc.

Then they have to deal with being criminals...who wants to hire people who served time in jail, even if it was only for a few days?

It affects poor people much more often and is a waste of time & money, IMO.

"Patton said he has lost sleep over her death. At the same time, he acknowledged that a short jail stint can sometimes "break the habit" of parents who'd rather party into the night than take their children to school the next day. The county started a program a few years ago that gives families 30 to 60 days to keep daily logs of each class and assignment. He estimated that the district truancy rate had dropped more than 30 percent."

if they don't want to be an active parent they shouldn't have children. the woman was living off the government. she was a stay at home mom. the least she could have done was be an active parent. stop blaming the court system. she put her self there.

LOL the system failed her? the system didn't make her have 7 kids. they didn't hold her down and say "you will have 7 children!" she shouldn't have had so many children. that's on her.

Apparently you must know nothing about bi-polar disorder...maybe it would be good to educate yourself about something before you make these kinds of statements. There are different levels of bi-polar disorder, and it can be very difficult for a person to live anything close to a normal life if they have a severe form of it. It's like other mental illnesses...even if she had been prescribed medication for it, it doesn't always help, and the people who suffer, and yes, I said SUFFER, from this disease don't always remember or are unable to take their medications for various reasons related to the illness.

It's a sad state of affairs that there is still a stigma attached to mental illness, and people would rather ignore it than try to understand it. Yes, I do think that the "system", whatever system it was, social services, the courts, the doctors, whatever, let her AND her children down. This should never have happened, but it also should not be blamed solely on this woman.

I stand by what I said. Then maybe we need some kind of law in place before people with a mental illness can have children if they are so, so fragile. Obviously they can't deal with life as so many of you want to keep posting about. It they are that fragile they shouldn't be bringing a life they have to care for into the world. It's abusive to allow a child to be raised in this environment.

[kittymomNC]

On 6/14/2014 herekitty_kitty said:

On 6/14/2014 kittymomNC said:

On 6/14/2014 herekitty_kitty said:

On 6/14/2014 terrier3 said:

I don't see how fining parents will solve this problem.

PA jails many people for other strange fines. One guy was jailed for catching a large mouth bass during small mouth bass season.

In my county in NY, a woman was jailed for having two overdue library books. She had been stopped for having a taillight out and when the police found the warrant for her arrest, she offered to pay for the books - $85 total (including fines). The police told her it was too late to pay and she was brought to jail. They denied her insulin, even though she complained, and she had a stroke. She is now suing.

It costs MORE money to process these people owing civil fines, jail them, etc.

Then they have to deal with being criminals...who wants to hire people who served time in jail, even if it was only for a few days?

It affects poor people much more often and is a waste of time & money, IMO.

"Patton said he has lost sleep over her death. At the same time, he acknowledged that a short jail stint can sometimes "break the habit" of parents who'd rather party into the night than take their children to school the next day. The county started a program a few years ago that gives families 30 to 60 days to keep daily logs of each class and assignment. He estimated that the district truancy rate had dropped more than 30 percent."

if they don't want to be an active parent they shouldn't have children. the woman was living off the government. she was a stay at home mom. the least she could have done was be an active parent. stop blaming the court system. she put her self there.

LOL the system failed her? the system didn't make her have 7 kids. they didn't hold her down and say "you will have 7 children!" she shouldn't have had so many children. that's on her.

Apparently you must know nothing about bi-polar disorder...maybe it would be good to educate yourself about something before you make these kinds of statements. There are different levels of bi-polar disorder, and it can be very difficult for a person to live anything close to a normal life if they have a severe form of it. It's like other mental illnesses...even if she had been prescribed medication for it, it doesn't always help, and the people who suffer, and yes, I said SUFFER, from this disease don't always remember or are unable to take their medications for various reasons related to the illness.

It's a sad state of affairs that there is still a stigma attached to mental illness, and people would rather ignore it than try to understand it. Yes, I do think that the "system", whatever system it was, social services, the courts, the doctors, whatever, let her AND her children down. This should never have happened, but it also should not be blamed solely on this woman.

I stand by what I said. Then maybe we need some kind of law in place before people with a mental illness can have children if they are so, so fragile. Obviously they can't deal with life as so many of you want to keep posting about. It they are that fragile they shouldn't be bringing a life they have to care for into the world. It's abusive to allow a child to be raised in this environment.

This statement just reinforces what I said, and it is directed at anyone who is guilty of it: It's a sad state of affairs that there is still a stigma attached to mental illness, and people would rather ignore it than try to understand it.

[abbeythe 8th]

On 6/14/2014 terrier3 said:

On 6/14/2014 Junebug54 said:

So why have 7 kids if you can't take care of them?

Maybe things were better before her husband died 3 years ago?

Maybe she is a devout Catholic and doesn't use BC -and chooses life over termination?

Maybe she is illiterate, bi-polar and doesn't speak English and was overwhelmed by the whole legal system?

Now WE have to care for her 7 kids...instead of intervening earlier with solutions instead of unfairly administered punishment.

The problems went back to 1999, long before her husband died. Her oldest child is 36. I would think there are more adults. The system will not have to take care of all her children.

[momma3gs]

herekitty, I understand what you're saying. What I have a problem with was jailing this woman. For whatever reasons, she did not have control of her children, and that's a separate matter and the reasons she was in that position could be debated on both sides with valid points. BUT, what purpose was served in putting her behind bars because she didn't have the funds to pay the fine for her childrens' truancy? She wasn't going to find the money in jail, she wasn't violent. She died in jail and now her children have no parents. There had to have been a better way to handle this. That's my point.

[pinkskates4]

On 6/14/2014 kittymomNC said:

On 6/14/2014 herekitty_kitty said:

On 6/14/2014 kittymomNC said:

On 6/14/2014 herekitty_kitty said:

On 6/14/2014 terrier3 said:

I don't see how fining parents will solve this problem.

PA jails many people for other strange fines. One guy was jailed for catching a large mouth bass during small mouth bass season.

In my county in NY, a woman was jailed for having two overdue library books. She had been stopped for having a taillight out and when the police found the warrant for her arrest, she offered to pay for the books - $85 total (including fines). The police told her it was too late to pay and she was brought to jail. They denied her insulin, even though she complained, and she had a stroke. She is now suing.

It costs MORE money to process these people owing civil fines, jail them, etc.

Then they have to deal with being criminals...who wants to hire people who served time in jail, even if it was only for a few days?

It affects poor people much more often and is a waste of time & money, IMO.

"Patton said he has lost sleep over her death. At the same time, he acknowledged that a short jail stint can sometimes "break the habit" of parents who'd rather party into the night than take their children to school the next day. The county started a program a few years ago that gives families 30 to 60 days to keep daily logs of each class and assignment. He estimated that the district truancy rate had dropped more than 30 percent."

if they don't want to be an active parent they shouldn't have children. the woman was living off the government. she was a stay at home mom. the least she could have done was be an active parent. stop blaming the court system. she put her self there.

LOL the system failed her? the system didn't make her have 7 kids. they didn't hold her down and say "you will have 7 children!" she shouldn't have had so many children. that's on her.

Apparently you must know nothing about bi-polar disorder...maybe it would be good to educate yourself about something before you make these kinds of statements. There are different levels of bi-polar disorder, and it can be very difficult for a person to live anything close to a normal life if they have a severe form of it. It's like other mental illnesses...even if she had been prescribed medication for it, it doesn't always help, and the people who suffer, and yes, I said SUFFER, from this disease don't always remember or are unable to take their medications for various reasons related to the illness.

It's a sad state of affairs that there is still a stigma attached to mental illness, and people would rather ignore it than try to understand it. Yes, I do think that the "system", whatever system it was, social services, the courts, the doctors, whatever, let her AND her children down. This should never have happened, but it also should not be blamed solely on this woman.

I stand by what I said. Then maybe we need some kind of law in place before people with a mental illness can have children if they are so, so fragile. Obviously they can't deal with life as so many of you want to keep posting about. It they are that fragile they shouldn't be bringing a life they have to care for into the world. It's abusive to allow a child to be raised in this environment.

This statement just reinforces what I said, and it is directed at anyone who is guilty of it: It's a sad state of affairs that there is still a stigma attached to mental illness, and people would rather ignore it than try to understand it.

OK - so what should have happened.

Should the school - rather than report her - have tried harder to work with her and her kids?

Should the police rather than serve her fines etc., have tried to help her somehow?

Should the judge who realized she wasn't coping have called CMS to check on the kids or should he have ordered someone else to check on her to be sure she was getting appropriate mental health help and/or taking her meds daily?

It's great to say people should "understand" but what should be done in these cases - particularly for the kids?