Community Chat

[ChazzyLady]

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@ZoetheCat wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@terrier3 wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

Ethics?

I worked for a very large national Bank & every associate was required to take Ethics Training.   No pity for associates who knowingly steal from their employer.  

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They weren't stealing from their employer - the bank forced them to sign up a quota of new accounts, and looked the other way for YEARS.

The bank stole fees from their customers...it's not like the clerks made extra money by doing what they were forced to do.

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The associates received incentive for those ill-gotten accounts....lots of inventive.  Add in quarterly bonuses for 'meeting their goal'...and possibly promotions & annual raise for meeting said goals.....it all adds up to getting lots of $$$ from unethical practices. 

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Do you not think that these associates would have been eliminated had they not "met their goal?"  Why do we not hold the bosses who forced them to meet a quota to account?  Why do we continue to blame those who have little power and let those who have NOTHING to lose get off scott free?  Mind boggling ...

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O.M.G. @ZoetheCat, the string of expletives going through my mind that I'd like to post here right now is so foul I would be deleted within nanoseconds!

I am still furious that long prison sentences weren't doled out for all those executives that not only crashed the U.S. economy but the world economy as well just a few short years ago. Believe me these massive financial crimes would seriously decrease if multiple CEOs were given the perp walk and decades of prison time. If I had the power, I would turn all those golden parachutes into lead.

[ZoetheCat]

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@momtochloe wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@terrier3 wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

Ethics?

I worked for a very large national Bank & every associate was required to take Ethics Training.   No pity for associates who knowingly steal from their employer.  

---

They weren't stealing from their employer - the bank forced them to sign up a quota of new accounts, and looked the other way for YEARS.

The bank stole fees from their customers...it's not like the clerks made extra money by doing what they were forced to do.

---

The associates received incentive for those ill-gotten accounts....lots of inventive.  Add in quarterly bonuses for 'meeting their goal'...and possibly promotions & annual raise for meeting said goals.....it all adds up to getting lots of $$$ from unethical practices. 

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@sidsmom so we all agree these practices are not a good thing right?

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Correct.

It doesn't matter if it's a part-time teller making minimum wage or

a multi-million dollar salaried CEO.  

Ethics are ethics.

Some upthread are implying the front-line associates should somehow be given a pass since their manager asked them to do something unethical. 

Don't work that way. 

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I gotta be honest.  This is incredible to me.  We all (or most of us) want to be ethical.  But if you need a job, and you need to pay the rent, and your boss is telling you that it's no problem to "bend the rules," I can understand that you might "bend the rules."  I am going to assume, perhaps unfairly, that most of us on this board do not have to deal with this on a daily basis.  But millions of Americans do deal with this on a daily basis.  Why, oh why, do we not seem willing to require that the "higher ups" also be ethical?  Why do we want to give them a pass?  I do not get it.  I never will.

[momtochloe]

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@momtochloe wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@terrier3 wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

Ethics?

I worked for a very large national Bank & every associate was required to take Ethics Training.   No pity for associates who knowingly steal from their employer.  

---

They weren't stealing from their employer - the bank forced them to sign up a quota of new accounts, and looked the other way for YEARS.

The bank stole fees from their customers...it's not like the clerks made extra money by doing what they were forced to do.

---

The associates received incentive for those ill-gotten accounts....lots of inventive.  Add in quarterly bonuses for 'meeting their goal'...and possibly promotions & annual raise for meeting said goals.....it all adds up to getting lots of $$$ from unethical practices. 

---

@sidsmom so we all agree these practices are not a good thing right?

---

Correct.

It doesn't matter if it's a part-time teller making minimum wage or

a multi-million dollar salaried CEO.  

Ethics are ethics.

Some upthread are implying the front-line associates should somehow be given a pass since their manager asked them to do something unethical. 

Don't work that way. 

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Fair enough @sidsmom but I would offer you this.  I have always held a good, well paying job with benefits.  Through the years I have had to take care of my parents and to be honest my career has suffered somewhat to make sure they were taken care of. 

I am now trying to find employment in an environment that is more than challenging but I will do whatever it takes to secure a job especially one with health benefits.

Please know I am older and compromising my integrity is something I would normally summarily dismiss but to be honest these days, it's tough.   I can't imagine being placed in that position but I am pretty sure I would say no but I do understand how maybe younger people would say yes to get ahead.

[ZoetheCat]

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@momtochloe wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@momtochloe wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

---

@terrier3 wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

Ethics?

I worked for a very large national Bank & every associate was required to take Ethics Training.   No pity for associates who knowingly steal from their employer.  

---

They weren't stealing from their employer - the bank forced them to sign up a quota of new accounts, and looked the other way for YEARS.

The bank stole fees from their customers...it's not like the clerks made extra money by doing what they were forced to do.

---

The associates received incentive for those ill-gotten accounts....lots of inventive.  Add in quarterly bonuses for 'meeting their goal'...and possibly promotions & annual raise for meeting said goals.....it all adds up to getting lots of $$$ from unethical practices. 

---

@sidsmom so we all agree these practices are not a good thing right?

---

Correct.

It doesn't matter if it's a part-time teller making minimum wage or

a multi-million dollar salaried CEO.  

Ethics are ethics.

Some upthread are implying the front-line associates should somehow be given a pass since their manager asked them to do something unethical. 

Don't work that way. 

---

Fair enough @sidsmom but I would offer you this.  I have always held a good, well paying job with benefits.  Through the years I have had to take care of my parents and to be honest my career has suffered somewhat to make sure they were taken care of. 

I am now trying to find employment in an environment that is more than challenging but I will do whatever it takes to secure a job especially one with health benefits.

Please know I am older and compromising my integrity is something I would normally summarily dismiss but to be honest these days, it's tough.   I can't imagine being placed in that position but I am pretty sure I would say no but I do understand how maybe younger people would say yes to get ahead.

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Exactly @momtochloe.  It's always easy for those of us in our ivory towers (and let's be honest, many of us on this board are living in ivory towers) to spout off about "ethics" and "integrity."  Obviously, the vast majority of us have a "line in the sand."  But, seriously, if one is forced to decide between keeping a job or going hungry, well, then it's not so simple.  And, meanwhile, those at the top don't have to worry about "ethics" versus "paying the rent."  They'll do just fine while they have their minions do their dirty work.  And, oh by the way, they will walk away with millions in compensation while their underlings get by (hopefully) on unemployment compensation. 

[sidsmom]

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@momtochloe wrote:

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@sidsmom wrote:

---

@momtochloe wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

---

@terrier3 wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

Ethics?

I worked for a very large national Bank & every associate was required to take Ethics Training.   No pity for associates who knowingly steal from their employer.  

---

They weren't stealing from their employer - the bank forced them to sign up a quota of new accounts, and looked the other way for YEARS.

The bank stole fees from their customers...it's not like the clerks made extra money by doing what they were forced to do.

---

The associates received incentive for those ill-gotten accounts....lots of inventive.  Add in quarterly bonuses for 'meeting their goal'...and possibly promotions & annual raise for meeting said goals.....it all adds up to getting lots of $$$ from unethical practices. 

---

@sidsmom so we all agree these practices are not a good thing right?

---

Correct.

It doesn't matter if it's a part-time teller making minimum wage or

a multi-million dollar salaried CEO.  

Ethics are ethics.

Some upthread are implying the front-line associates should somehow be given a pass since their manager asked them to do something unethical. 

Don't work that way. 

---

Fair enough @sidsmom but I would offer you this.  I have always held a good, well paying job with benefits.  Through the years I have had to take care of my parents and to be honest my career has suffered somewhat to make sure they were taken care of. 

I am now trying to find employment in an environment that is more than challenging but I will do whatever it takes to secure a job especially one with health benefits.

Please know I am older and compromising my integrity is something I would normally summarily dismiss but to be honest these days, it's tough.   I can't imagine being placed in that position but I am pretty sure I would say no but I do understand how maybe younger people would say yes to get ahead.

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Woulda

Coulda

Shoulda

Young, old, entry leveL, CEO....all associates are held to the same Code of Ethics.  And yes, you would say no.....but no, I don't understand why younger people would say yes to get ahead. That decision is inside your soul. Doesn't matter if you can't pay rent.  Ethics, morals...that's something inside us good people (!), so it really doesn't matter if it's applied to work or life.  

@momtochloe.  It's all good. I survived 30 yrs in banking upholding my company's Code of Ethics.  I've got ALOT of war stories.  

[MyGirlsMom]

I watched the roast and I coulda hugged her! 

[ZoetheCat]

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@sidsmom wrote:

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@momtochloe wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

---

@momtochloe wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

---

@terrier3 wrote:

---

@sidsmom wrote:

Ethics?

I worked for a very large national Bank & every associate was required to take Ethics Training.   No pity for associates who knowingly steal from their employer.  

---

They weren't stealing from their employer - the bank forced them to sign up a quota of new accounts, and looked the other way for YEARS.

The bank stole fees from their customers...it's not like the clerks made extra money by doing what they were forced to do.

---

The associates received incentive for those ill-gotten accounts....lots of inventive.  Add in quarterly bonuses for 'meeting their goal'...and possibly promotions & annual raise for meeting said goals.....it all adds up to getting lots of $$$ from unethical practices. 

---

@sidsmom so we all agree these practices are not a good thing right?

---

Correct.

It doesn't matter if it's a part-time teller making minimum wage or

a multi-million dollar salaried CEO.  

Ethics are ethics.

Some upthread are implying the front-line associates should somehow be given a pass since their manager asked them to do something unethical. 

Don't work that way. 

---

Fair enough @sidsmom but I would offer you this.  I have always held a good, well paying job with benefits.  Through the years I have had to take care of my parents and to be honest my career has suffered somewhat to make sure they were taken care of. 

I am now trying to find employment in an environment that is more than challenging but I will do whatever it takes to secure a job especially one with health benefits.

Please know I am older and compromising my integrity is something I would normally summarily dismiss but to be honest these days, it's tough.   I can't imagine being placed in that position but I am pretty sure I would say no but I do understand how maybe younger people would say yes to get ahead.

---

Woulda

Coulda

Shoulda

Young, old, entry leveL, CEO....all associates are held to the same Code of Ethics.  And yes, you would say no.....but no, I don't understand why younger people would say yes to get ahead. That decision is inside your soul. Doesn't matter if you can't pay rent.  Ethics, morals...that's something inside us good people (!), so it really doesn't matter if it's applied to work or life.  

@momtochloe.  It's all good. I survived 30 yrs in banking upholding my company's Code of Ethics.  I've got ALOT of war stories.  

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@sidsmom.  I understand what you are saying about ethics and morals.  But, truly, I have to ask, you have survived 30 years in banking, and I think you are probably about my age.  Do you recall being asked to "compromise" the way today's employees are being asked to compromise.  I've been around quite a while.  When I started out, I went to work each day, did my job, and went home.  I wasn't being pressured to "bend the rules." It was a different time.  It infuriates me that we are so willing to knock the "workers" but we let the higher ups get away with this nonsense.  They are setting the rules. They are deciding who gets to keep a job and who falls by the wayside.  They call all the shots. Why are they not accountable?  Why are we so quick to bash the worker and let the bosses get away scott free?

[Silver Fox1]

How could anyone not be a fan of Elizabeth Warren she's always looking out for the little guy ?  Thank God for people like her in goverment, there are way to few and far between of them !!!!!!!!!!!

[ChazzyLady]

Well if the original post and link by @momtochloe didn't get your blood boiling, then this story most definitely will:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/elizabeth-warren-john-stumpf-wells-fargo_us_57e1591ee4b04a1497b6...

It gives a bit more detail on how that weasel of a Wells Fargo CEO, John Stumpf, initially tried to blame a few bad apples among the lower level employees for this outrage.  But good ol' Elizabeth Warren was having NONE of that! That woman rocks!

BTW, now that I think about it, I would like to extend a public apology to all actual weasels, which are kinda cute, for comparing them to John Stumpf:

Sorry weasels; my bad.

[mstyrion 1]

Count me in as another huge Elizabeth Warren fan.

She spoke for all of us when she called thosed execs "gutless".

@ZoetheCat,

I also get what you're saying.  The articles I've read show a systematic agenda brought down from the highest levels that intimidated and threatneded employees who couldn't or wouldn't "make the numbers". 

Lower level managers had 4 meetings a day to go over the sales numbers. The employees exhausted all their family member and friends contacts to get the sales needed to keep their jobs. Management knew when the cheating started and did nothing to stop it. 

No, I don't condone what the employees did, but I understand it. Intimidation, fear and desperation does ugly things to people.  

The old morality was that the people in charge were ultimately responsible for the acts of the employees.  When did things change that they get a pass?