Wellness

[Ginny630]

I am in physical therapy right now for both my knees. I have had cortisone shots on both knees and am now going to be going for gel shots once a week for four weeks. We are trying to avoid double knee implants for a few years. My PT people are awesome and if I feel pain other than just the burning from the muscle which I should feel they stop immediately and do something else. Sorry you are having a bad experience. I hope everything works out for you.

[BigBro6]

Well, I was in very great pain with both knees swollen. With the one knee problems walking up stairs. Before my groin & hip injury, I was on the treadmill, walking outside and exercise bike. So, I was active. My meniscus tear injury in 08' I had an assistant PT, did the leg press and guess what swollen surgery knee ! So, I should had said no. My doc gave me anti-inflammatory pills and ordered a CT arthrogram. No MRI pacemaker. I have BCBS doing a physicians review for my arthrogram. I would love to slide in a MRI, but cannot morons !!

[Bird mama]

BigBro6, I've worked for a health insurance company for over 30 years. When I was a claims adjudicator, I used to see many claims for PT that indicated additional aggravation due to physical therapy. That more or less put a fear of therapists in me (coward I know). I've had knee surgery and adhesive capsulitis (frozen shoulder), both times rehabbed at home. As a matter of fact, when I saw the shoulder specialist in '04 for the shoulder, he said, I could send you to PT, but they will likely hurt you more than help you . Whenever possible, I ask for the booklet of exercises. I'm a good patient and will do what they ask of me, at home.

I'm sorry your knees are feeling worse than when you started. I don't believe all physical therapists are bad, you just have to be so careful.

[Moonchilde]

On 8/23/2014 hckynut said:

On 8/22/2014 moonchilde said: I had PT in a vain attempt to "improve/cure" my Achilles tendinosis - a condition where even orthopedists admit there is little that can be done. So PT is one of the things they 'throw at it.' I quit after all the stretching they had me doing, increasingly aggressively, was causing nightly major muscle cramps in my calves and feet, and even cramping in my inner thigh muscles (now THAT is PAIN at 2 a.m.). Many sleepless, pain-filled nights.

This depends on the Orthopod and is not always true. I have had Achilles Tendonitis and Achilles Tendinosis and never had to quit running or skating because of it. I did however: maximize the extension of all the above rear leg muscles and connective tissues/put heel lifts in all my shoes/ice them at home often and also carried ice with me to work in my Igloo Cooler. I would ice them on my breaks and at lunch time.

I know what caused mine and I eliminated, as much as possible, what I considered to be the primary cause of these Tendinosis. First was the Tendonitis and it led to the Tendinosis because I was not vigilant enough of watching what might be causing the Tendonitis and also was not doing everything I could with ICE as much as possible.

Of course almost any kind of "itis" or "osis" can be helped somewhat with anti-inflammatory meds, either OTC or prescription. At times I could not take them because of internal bleeding and/or being on blood thinners.

My suggestion here is to always find a Sports Medicine Certified Doctor in whatever field ones injury may fall. The many I've met over decades there has been only 1 of them that told me to "quit doing what I was doing", and that was only for a short period of time. I listened and my injury gradually heeled over a 4 month period.

I have also have Tenosynovitis which is even worse than the "itis" or "osis" and I decided I did not want to quit to hasten the injury. My SMD told me I could not injure it further but it would take longer to heal. I chose "longer to heal".

My condition has nothing whatever to do with sport or any type of sport injury, believe me. It did not just appear after jogging, running, etc. There is no way for me to stop the "cause" unless I spend the rest of my life in wheelchairs or scooters, not walking. The tears and adhesions are accumulations of many years of simply walking. Not all Achilles injuries are sports injuries. The doctor I see is one at a large clinic in a large urban area which specializes in sports injuries. It is a sports medicine specialist who told me they would not want to do surgery unless I became unable to do any ADL, and a sports medicine specialist who sent me to PT, which I think he knew was pointless, but many insurance companies insist doctors "start with the basics" and until the patient has done so, they won't pay for anything else. The PT office was one serving a nationally famous university medical center, yet they seemed to be pretty clueless about therapy for the condition, in retrospect. They treated me as if I *was* an athlete, which is, I think, why I had the subsequent issues after every treatment. The only treatment the doctor strongly suggested was plasmapheresis/platelet-rich plasma into the area, which is experimental (with mixed, not exciting results), only partially paid for by insurance, and would cost me about $1500 out of pocket - with about a 40% success rate and a total of about 18 weeks off work. So far I have said no. The odds vs. cost vs. recovery time seem ridiculous.

[BigBro6]

On 8/24/2014 moonchilde said:

On 8/23/2014 hckynut said:

On 8/22/2014 moonchilde said: I had PT in a vain attempt to "improve/cure" my Achilles tendinosis - a condition where even orthopedists admit there is little that can be done. So PT is one of the things they 'throw at it.' I quit after all the stretching they had me doing, increasingly aggressively, was causing nightly major muscle cramps in my calves and feet, and even cramping in my inner thigh muscles (now THAT is PAIN at 2 a.m.). Many sleepless, pain-filled nights.

This depends on the Orthopod and is not always true. I have had Achilles Tendonitis and Achilles Tendinosis and never had to quit running or skating because of it. I did however: maximize the extension of all the above rear leg muscles and connective tissues/put heel lifts in all my shoes/ice them at home often and also carried ice with me to work in my Igloo Cooler. I would ice them on my breaks and at lunch time.

I know what caused mine and I eliminated, as much as possible, what I considered to be the primary cause of these Tendinosis. First was the Tendonitis and it led to the Tendinosis because I was not vigilant enough of watching what might be causing the Tendonitis and also was not doing everything I could with ICE as much as possible.

Of course almost any kind of "itis" or "osis" can be helped somewhat with anti-inflammatory meds, either OTC or prescription. At times I could not take them because of internal bleeding and/or being on blood thinners.

My suggestion here is to always find a Sports Medicine Certified Doctor in whatever field ones injury may fall. The many I've met over decades there has been only 1 of them that told me to "quit doing what I was doing", and that was only for a short period of time. I listened and my injury gradually heeled over a 4 month period.

I have also have Tenosynovitis which is even worse than the "itis" or "osis" and I decided I did not want to quit to hasten the injury. My SMD told me I could not injure it further but it would take longer to heal. I chose "longer to heal".

My condition has nothing whatever to do with sport or any type of sport injury, believe me. It did not just appear after jogging, running, etc. There is no way for me to stop the "cause" unless I spend the rest of my life in wheelchairs or scooters, not walking. The tears and adhesions are accumulations of many years of simply walking. Not all Achilles injuries are sports injuries. The doctor I see is one at a large clinic in a large urban area which specializes in sports injuries. It is a sports medicine specialist who told me they would not want to do surgery unless I became unable to do any ADL, and a sports medicine specialist who sent me to PT, which I think he knew was pointless, but many insurance companies insist doctors "start with the basics" and until the patient has done so, they won't pay for anything else. The PT office was one serving a nationally famous university medical center, yet they seemed to be pretty clueless about therapy for the condition, in retrospect. They treated me as if I *was* an athlete, which is, I think, why I had the subsequent issues after every treatment. The only treatment the doctor strongly suggested was plasmapheresis into the area, which is experimental (with mixed, not exciting results), only partially paid for by insurance, and would cost me about $1500 out of pocket - with about a 40% success rate and a total of about 18 weeks off work. So far I have said no. The odds vs. cost vs. recovery time seem ridiculous.

Its a cookie cutter society. I notice table after table doing the same exercises. She had me stretching over head and back with a very large exercise ball lying down. I told her my stretching ability is not as good with the pacemaker, so stopped. The PT said she would come up with something else ....never did (too lazy or she wanted cookie cutter people). I too am not athletic, just active to maintain weight for rest of my life. My insurance has paid for PT visits but questioning a CT scan to look more at a more detail picture ??? It could benefit everyone !

[Moonchilde]

On 8/24/2014 BigBro6 said:

On 8/24/2014 moonchilde said:

On 8/23/2014 hckynut said:

On 8/22/2014 moonchilde said: I had PT in a vain attempt to "improve/cure" my Achilles tendinosis - a condition where even orthopedists admit there is little that can be done. So PT is one of the things they 'throw at it.' I quit after all the stretching they had me doing, increasingly aggressively, was causing nightly major muscle cramps in my calves and feet, and even cramping in my inner thigh muscles (now THAT is PAIN at 2 a.m.). Many sleepless, pain-filled nights.

This depends on the Orthopod and is not always true. I have had Achilles Tendonitis and Achilles Tendinosis and never had to quit running or skating because of it. I did however: maximize the extension of all the above rear leg muscles and connective tissues/put heel lifts in all my shoes/ice them at home often and also carried ice with me to work in my Igloo Cooler. I would ice them on my breaks and at lunch time.

I know what caused mine and I eliminated, as much as possible, what I considered to be the primary cause of these Tendinosis. First was the Tendonitis and it led to the Tendinosis because I was not vigilant enough of watching what might be causing the Tendonitis and also was not doing everything I could with ICE as much as possible.

Of course almost any kind of "itis" or "osis" can be helped somewhat with anti-inflammatory meds, either OTC or prescription. At times I could not take them because of internal bleeding and/or being on blood thinners.

My suggestion here is to always find a Sports Medicine Certified Doctor in whatever field ones injury may fall. The many I've met over decades there has been only 1 of them that told me to "quit doing what I was doing", and that was only for a short period of time. I listened and my injury gradually heeled over a 4 month period.

I have also have Tenosynovitis which is even worse than the "itis" or "osis" and I decided I did not want to quit to hasten the injury. My SMD told me I could not injure it further but it would take longer to heal. I chose "longer to heal".

My condition has nothing whatever to do with sport or any type of sport injury, believe me. It did not just appear after jogging, running, etc. There is no way for me to stop the "cause" unless I spend the rest of my life in wheelchairs or scooters, not walking. The tears and adhesions are accumulations of many years of simply walking. Not all Achilles injuries are sports injuries. The doctor I see is one at a large clinic in a large urban area which specializes in sports injuries. It is a sports medicine specialist who told me they would not want to do surgery unless I became unable to do any ADL, and a sports medicine specialist who sent me to PT, which I think he knew was pointless, but many insurance companies insist doctors "start with the basics" and until the patient has done so, they won't pay for anything else. The PT office was one serving a nationally famous university medical center, yet they seemed to be pretty clueless about therapy for the condition, in retrospect. They treated me as if I *was* an athlete, which is, I think, why I had the subsequent issues after every treatment. The only treatment the doctor strongly suggested was plasmapheresis into the area, which is experimental (with mixed, not exciting results), only partially paid for by insurance, and would cost me about $1500 out of pocket - with about a 40% success rate and a total of about 18 weeks off work. So far I have said no. The odds vs. cost vs. recovery time seem ridiculous.

Its a cookie cutter society. I notice table after table doing the same exercises. She had me stretching over head and back with a very large exercise ball lying down. I told her my stretching ability is not as good with the pacemaker, so stopped. The PT said she would come up with something else ....never did (too lazy or she wanted cookie cutter people). I too am not athletic, just active to maintain weight for rest of my life. My insurance has paid for PT visits but questioning a CT scan to look more at a more detail picture ??? It could benefit everyone !

This office seemed to gear my therapy to the recommended therapy for runners, and wanted me to stay "on schedule" as to what an athlete would have accomplished in their "recovery" from a "temporary, acute" condition. I don't think they HAD a regimen for a 60-something non-athlete with a *chronic* condition, and didn't want to bother trying to accommodate or modify.

[hckynut]

On 8/24/2014 moonchilde said:

My condition has nothing whatever to do with sport or any type of sport injury, believe me. It did not just appear after jogging, running, etc. There is no way for me to stop the "cause" unless I spend the rest of my life in wheelchairs or scooters, not walking. The tears and adhesions are accumulations of many years of simply walking. Not all Achilles injuries are sports injuries. The doctor I see is one at a large clinic in a large urban area which specializes in sports injuries. It is a sports medicine specialist who told me they would not want to do surgery unless I became unable to do any ADL, and a sports medicine specialist who sent me to PT, which I think he knew was pointless, but many insurance companies insist doctors "start with the basics" and until the patient has done so, they won't pay for anything else. The PT office was one serving a nationally famous university medical center, yet they seemed to be pretty clueless about therapy for the condition, in retrospect. They treated me as if I *was* an athlete, which is, I think, why I had the subsequent issues after every treatment. The only treatment the doctor strongly suggested was plasmapheresis/platelet-rich plasma into the area, which is experimental (with mixed, not exciting results), only partially paid for by insurance, and would cost me about $1500 out of pocket - with about a 40% success rate and a total of about 18 weeks off work. So far I have said no. The odds vs. cost vs. recovery time seem ridiculous.

I don't remember saying that all Achilles Tendon injuries are "sports injuries". If that was the case my Sports Med Certified Podiatrist would lose a lot of business. I mention sports only because that is where I got some my experiences. Learned more from attending many seminars with Sports Med Certified Doctors and Therapists from many different specialties.

I will say that experiencing an injury, from walking/running/skating/skiing is far and away the most personal way of understanding many injuries as they usually get the attention of the person that is injured. Talking with some that have not had this type of injury many times goes in one ear and out the other, until?

Accumulated from walking over many years. You had no sign something was going wrong during "those many years of simply walking"? Before things get to an "itis" or an "osis" there are usually many warning signs along the way. Could be yours is a genetic issue, beats me. I know there has always been for myself and the many runners/hockey players, and yes, just those that walked a lot of their jobs. Counseled many of my co-workers/hockey friends and others along the way.

Got 2 good friends that play in my hockey league that are Sports Med Certified Orthopods. One is a Spinal Specialist and the other specializes in Shoulder/Hip and Knee repair and replacement. He however also has been the Sports Doctor for 2 Professional Hockey Teams and knows a lot about Achilles Tendon issues, even though they are not as common in hockey as in other running type of sports.

In hockey your foot is in a tight boot and your feet stay pretty much in contact with the insole of the skate. In walking and running movements the Achilles Tendon has to stretch and contract during heel/toe type of movements. This does not happen when ice skating as most of the strain is on the upper rear leg muscles and not the Achilles Tendons.

Could add a ton more but I will end with, good luck to you.

[Moonchilde]

Hindsight is cheap, and easy. "Signs(s)"? Possibly. But the occasional annoying symptom that comes and goes, improves, morphs into a different symptom then disappears for a year or two before returning does not exactly scream "you clearly have something seriously wrong and must go have it checked out." I have worked in the healthcare industry for 45 years and have kept up with many specialties. Orthopedics doesn't happen to be one of them.

[mousiegirl]

Eons ago, when I had a hip replacement due to a childhood injury, my Doctor said he didn't believe in physical therapy, so gave me exercises to do while in bed., and that was fine with me. I recovered very quickly. He must have known of people having been damaged due to physical therapy. I had pt for a thumb injury, and after a short time, my thumb and the three fingers next to it were numb, right before Thanksgiving, so that is how I prepared the meal, and I never went back.

[spent2much]

I sure do empathize with you. I had a bad meniscus tear in L knee (could barely walk) and had surgery for it. The PT post-surgery was difficult and not enjoyable, but I had a female PT whom I trusted. That was after my first visit with a male PT who thought he was a gift to the medical field. I refused to see him after that (he hurt me and didn't care) and saw the female PT who pushed me, but not too far. Yes, listen to your instincts!!!