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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS


@LoriLori wrote:

Hope I didn't interrupt the flow of your fun stories!!!!  Heart.  


 

            Of course not, @LoriLori!❤️   Just the ebb and flow of threads.

 

⭐️“He drew a circle that shut me out. Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout. But Love and I had the wit to win: we drew a circle that welcomed him in.” ~E. Markham ⭐️

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS

[ Edited ]

@LoriLori wrote:

@yahooey wrote:

@Icegoddess @mtc @LoriLori @dooBdoo @GoinBacktoCali 

 

if you have 45 minutes - an interesting 2013 video of Haute Couture 

I am repulsed and intrigued at the same time

 

https://youtu.be/Wqkgo6fV8q8

 

Screen Shot 2019-06-03 at 5.11.15 AM.png


 

also @luvitorleaveit   @mousiegirl 


Yahooey, first, thank you so much!!!  I just watched it.

 

Fascinating!  And in a crowded field of fashion documentaries, utterly unique.

It focuses on a secretive private club comprised of a group of women into which one must be invited working with French couture designers to acquire haute couture fashions. 


(Haute couture is a legal term France, where the government issues licenses for those who meet rigorous standards. Haute couture in France goes back to the 1800s. This is me, not the doc, which doesn't waste time on history except of garments.)

 

These women are very, very wealthy but they're not household names nor do they seek publicity.  Invitation requires deep knowledge of and love of couture, contemporary and historical, and wearing the clothes.  They are in it for purely for the art of fashion.

Only two designers agreed to be in it, the now-disgraced John Galliano and Chanel's Karl Lagerfeld.  Watching it it I was reminded of Paris FW, not long after his death, where models walked in the last collection he designed and sobbed at the end of the runway.

 

We see Chanel's staircase. We are taken to the off-premises haute couture space which is just for working with feathers.

(That blew my mind but also reminded me of the workers from UK's Royal School of Needlework, expert lacemakers who created the lace appliques for Kate Middleton's wedding gown and elite seamstresses who hand-sewed them on and were made to wash their hands every half hour.)

Few women would speak. We don't even know exactly how they're invited in and I'm not sure they do either.  It involves the breadth and depth of their knowledge of haute couture and also having discreetly raised massive amounts for charity (one woman has a section of the Met named for her and her husband).

They buy the clothes to collect but also to wear. They view them as the art pieces they are, and they eventually are donated to museums.

I've deleted a lot because I don't want to give it away, hoping you'll watch. I sat transfixed throughout. 

 

Dahlings, I think everyone who can spare 45 minutes to watch will be glad they did.

And now Yahooey, I'm even more curious to know in what way you were "repulsed."  

 


 

                 I just watched the video and returned to post about it, so I'll add a couple of comments about uneasy feelings I had.    I do find it difficult to explain.  There was a sort of strange subtext that felt dark to me...  now and then a slightly contemptuous pretentious air, the frequent mention of the "husbands' money," "husbands' wallets,"  "husband's permission," the deep discount only for women thin enough to buy the model's original (I understand the reason, but still part of some unsettling themes), the fact that Karl Lagerfeld had to lose weight to to comply with "club rules about fatties," that sort of thing.    Some themes that Margy Kinmonth may or may not have intended.   Also, the hoards of couture garments hidden away, seldom worn or seen, made me sad.    They likened them to paintings and other artwork and it reminded me of the magnificent pieces held apart from all but a few eyes and rarely seen by the majority of humanity.   

            I see and appreciate the artistry in the garments, and in the early part of the film that was my instant and instinctual feeling -- these are fine art, beautifully designed and crafted.    But I left the documentary feeling sad.    I know so many artists who create one-of-a-kind pieces, and part of their joy is that people buy and display their work (whether worn on the body or otherwise displayed) for many eyes to see.    I realize all this might be solely my own, personal response and that always is a good chance for my own insight and self-reflection.    I might watch the documentary again, later.

            Fabulous synopsis, @LoriLori!    Thank you for taking time to write that.   It was well worth the time to view, certainly a remarkable, sumptuous feast for the eyes and a lot of food for thought.😊

 

⭐️“He drew a circle that shut me out. Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout. But Love and I had the wit to win: we drew a circle that welcomed him in.” ~E. Markham ⭐️

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS


@dooBdoo wrote:

                 I just watched the video and returned to post about it, so I'll add a couple of comments about uneasy feelings I had.    I do find it difficult to explain.  There was a sort of strange subtext that felt dark to me...  now and then a slightly contemptuous pretentious air, the frequent mention of the "husbands' money," "husbands' wallets,"  "husband's permission," the deep discount only for women thin enough to buy the model's original (I understand the reason, but still part of some unsettling themes), the fact that Karl Lagerfeld had to lose weight to to comply with "club rules about fatties," that sort of thing.    Some themes that Margy Kinmonth may or may not have intended.   Also, the hoards of couture garments hidden away, seldom worn or seen, made me sad.    They likened them to paintings and other artwork and it reminded me of the magnificent pieces held apart from all but a few eyes and rarely seen by the majority of humanity.   

            I see and appreciate the artistry in the garments, and in the early part of the film that was my instant and instinctual feeling -- these are fine art, beautifully designed and crafted.    But I left the documentary feeling sad.    I know so many artists who create one-of-a-kind pieces, and part of their joy is that people buy and display their work (whether worn on the body or otherwise displayed) for many eyes to see.    I realize all this might be solely my own, personal response and that always is a good chance for my own insight and self-reflection.    I might watch the documentary again, later.

            Fabulous synopsis, @LoriLori!    Thank you for taking time to write that.   It was well worth the time to view, certainly a remarkable, sumptuous feast for the eyes and a lot of food for thought.😊

 


It took me quite awhile to watch this.  Had to do it in bits and pieces.  I agree with you @dooBdoo.  I have never been much for pretentiousness, and having studied and worked in a male-dominated field I cringe at the mention of it being the husbands paying for everything.  

 

It is kinda sad that so much work goes into these dresses and then they end up tucked away in a closet possibly never to be seen again.  I rather liked the lady who was wearing the old jacket and at the end also wore an "old" gown. 

 

I love the detail that goes into these pieces and I am a huge fan of vintage and the beautiful textiles.  

 

I sorta wondered about the lady who was the heiress to the Toys R Us empire since Toys R Us no longer exists.  I'm sure she came out of it just fine, but I had to wonder if club members ever get kicked out due to no longer meeting one of the requirements.  

 

On another topic, I noticed this morning that some of my TV channels were not receiving a signal.  We are getting some much needed raain, but it was very light and no reason to be blocking the signal.  Then, I noticed Bravo was one of those channels so I went into troubleshooting mode.  Luckily, I was able to get the signal back.  It appears the rain had weighed down some tree branches blocking some of the signal, although many channels were coming through just fine.  So, hopefully I cleared enough to keep the signal although once the rain ends I'll probably need to do some more trimming just to make sure.

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS

Oh goodness well may I say it does make a difference when you are able to stay awake for the full 90 minutes.  I am just now rewatching last week's episode and everything makes so much more sense but my favorite line was when Brandon said about a Sebastian garment "I don't care if it has a story or not, I would throw my hair up in a top knot, slip that on and watch everyone stare at me".  Good grief, I just love that man!

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS


@mtc wrote:

Oh goodness well may I say it does make a difference when you are able to stay awake for the full 90 minutes.  I am just now rewatching last week's episode and everything makes so much more sense but my favorite line was when Brandon said about a Sebastian garment "I don't care if it has a story or not, I would throw my hair up in a top knot, slip that on and watch everyone stare at me".  Good grief, I just love that man!


The idea of having to have a story to go with your fashion all the time would throw me too.  I think you can have an inspiriation to draw from without having to have a whole story.  And, I agree with Brandon's comment.  Sometimes you just like something because it just hits the right chord for you and who cares about a story.

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS


@dooBdoo wrote:

@LoriLori wrote:

@yahooey wrote:

@Icegoddess @mtc @LoriLori @dooBdoo @GoinBacktoCali 

 

if you have 45 minutes - an interesting 2013 video of Haute Couture 

I am repulsed and intrigued at the same time

 

https://youtu.be/Wqkgo6fV8q8

 

Screen Shot 2019-06-03 at 5.11.15 AM.png


 

also @luvitorleaveit   @mousiegirl 


Yahooey, first, thank you so much!!!  I just watched it.

 

Fascinating!  And in a crowded field of fashion documentaries, utterly unique.

It focuses on a secretive private club comprised of a group of women into which one must be invited working with French couture designers to acquire haute couture fashions. 


(Haute couture is a legal term France, where the government issues licenses for those who meet rigorous standards. Haute couture in France goes back to the 1800s. This is me, not the doc, which doesn't waste time on history except of garments.)

 

These women are very, very wealthy but they're not household names nor do they seek publicity.  Invitation requires deep knowledge of and love of couture, contemporary and historical, and wearing the clothes.  They are in it for purely for the art of fashion.

Only two designers agreed to be in it, the now-disgraced John Galliano and Chanel's Karl Lagerfeld.  Watching it it I was reminded of Paris FW, not long after his death, where models walked in the last collection he designed and sobbed at the end of the runway.

 

We see Chanel's staircase. We are taken to the off-premises haute couture space which is just for working with feathers.

(That blew my mind but also reminded me of the workers from UK's Royal School of Needlework, expert lacemakers who created the lace appliques for Kate Middleton's wedding gown and elite seamstresses who hand-sewed them on and were made to wash their hands every half hour.)

Few women would speak. We don't even know exactly how they're invited in and I'm not sure they do either.  It involves the breadth and depth of their knowledge of haute couture and also having discreetly raised massive amounts for charity (one woman has a section of the Met named for her and her husband).

They buy the clothes to collect but also to wear. They view them as the art pieces they are, and they eventually are donated to museums.

I've deleted a lot because I don't want to give it away, hoping you'll watch. I sat transfixed throughout. 

 

Dahlings, I think everyone who can spare 45 minutes to watch will be glad they did.

And now Yahooey, I'm even more curious to know in what way you were "repulsed."  

 


 

                 I just watched the video and returned to post about it, so I'll add a couple of comments about uneasy feelings I had.    I do find it difficult to explain.  There was a sort of strange subtext that felt dark to me...  now and then a slightly contemptuous pretentious air, the frequent mention of the "husbands' money," "husbands' wallets,"  "husband's permission," the deep discount only for women thin enough to buy the model's original (I understand the reason, but still part of some unsettling themes), the fact that Karl Lagerfeld had to lose weight to to comply with "club rules about fatties," that sort of thing.    Some themes that Margy Kinmonth may or may not have intended.   Also, the hoards of couture garments hidden away, seldom worn or seen, made me sad.    They likened them to paintings and other artwork and it reminded me of the magnificent pieces held apart from all but a few eyes and rarely seen by the majority of humanity.   

            I see and appreciate the artistry in the garments, and in the early part of the film that was my instant and instinctual feeling -- these are fine art, beautifully designed and crafted.    But I left the documentary feeling sad.    I know so many artists who create one-of-a-kind pieces, and part of their joy is that people buy and display their work (whether worn on the body or otherwise displayed) for many eyes to see.    I realize all this might be solely my own, personal response and that always is a good chance for my own insight and self-reflection.    I might watch the documentary again, later.

            Fabulous synopsis, @LoriLori!    Thank you for taking time to write that.   It was well worth the time to view, certainly a remarkable, sumptuous feast for the eyes and a lot of food for thought.😊

 


 

 

@dooBdoo    

 

Thanks, Doob.  Have been chewing on your comments ever since I read your post.  @Icegoddess  , just saw yours now because you didn't @ me...And @yahooey , you who started this LOL, have still not explained your revulsion!  LOL.  I'm wondering if it overlaps with Doob's?

 

Doob, I have given so much thought to your comments because your comments are so thoughtful.  Here's my thoughts on your thoughts:

 

Karl Lagerfeld:   I agree.  Except what I took from that is my, how far we've come.  He was old and old-school and probably would detest the changes happening in the industry -- the graduates of the best programs onlly are still at least a year from learning how to dress more than a size 0/2.  So while they were offensive I took heart that the industry is moving past them.  Slowly, but steadily. 

 

[Like Ali Stroker winning the Tony last night.  It blew me away.  I remember her in The Glee Project.  She didn't even win.  They put her on the show anyway, near the end of its run when it wasn't very good anymore...Anyway it's only her second Broadway show, her first role -- and wow, it took my breath away.  Inconceivable not long ago!  And she's so deserving.   Sorry for the digression yet I know you're there with me in it.]

 

The women:   I didn't mind any of them.  

 

The Petrys (sp?) who have a wing at the Met, if I recall correctly she was oldest one and the one with the "my husband" attitude and "my husband's wallet."  Because she's old school I don't fault her for that.  She's lived in an insular world.  She'll never meet you or me and be changed by us.  But she's changed us by endowing that piece of the Met.  And she has that maid whose sole job is to care for the piece.  So I don't mind her a bit.  

 

i didn't feel like she's pretentious because none of these women are ostentatious.  I appreciated their reluctance to participate and how few of them did.  Pretentious to me is Capote's swans led by Bebe Paley, who demanded to be seen but not heard.  The older woman in the doc lunches daily in a Chanel suit but doesn't call Page Six and I feel strongly she would never gossip about the others to a Truman Capote.  So we part ways there for that and I'd love if you respond and get it if you don't.

 

Hidden away:   I agree completely, just it doesn't make me sad.  Because donating is built into that club, it's expected.  And because so much art purchased in the past few decades is privately owned but every exhibition I've ever been to has many "on loan by" plaques and honestly the museums own so many treasures they can only display a fraction permanently too. 

 

And still The Met Costume Institute, the V&A and the few other serious fashion museum collections have way too many pieces to display (The Met has over 33,000) so to me it's a difference without a distinction

 

It seems an expectation of the club that these creations will be donated whereas not all of the paintings bought by Silicon Valley and Japanese billionaires will lend theirs.  So the way the club does it may even be better.

 

In any case I feel that these pieces are loved and cared for, worn and donated, and so it doesn't make me sad at all.  

 

Ice:

 

They all wear their garments, it's part of how and why you're in the club.  See above for "tucked away."   There are Rembrandts and Michelangelos etc. "tucked away.'  It can't be helped. 

 

I was so fortunate to see the pieces of the Isabella Stuart Gardner collection in Boston before they were stolen.  Those are lost forever probably.  These haute couture garments are not.

 

Just FYI "the lady who was wearing the jacket" and was shown at the end in the gown is Daphne Guiness, heir to Guiness Beer, a former model and now a designer herself.   She has a higher profile which surprised me; maybe she had not started designing when she was originally invited. The event itself seemed small and exclusive.   In any case all the ladies wear the clothes and care for them, it's part of being in the club, it's just that Daphne Guiness is well used to cameras and courts them.

 

As for Toys R Us when companies go bankrupt their billionaires don't but should they fall on hard times they would probably have the class to just quietly donate the garments and drop out of sight.  It would be tasteless for the club to kick out anyone for losing their fortune so I doubt they do.

 

Daphne Guiness -- 

 

 

 

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS

@dooBdoo   @Icegoddess   @yahooey 

 

One more thing:  It truly is a dying art.   The list of licensed coutouriers is shrinking dramatically, scarily.  Less than twenty now.  That makes me sad.

 

The creation of licensed real French haute couture will be gone in our lifetimes so I'm grateful not just to the filmmaker but also to the women of this club for preserving it. 

 

Who knows what women who are not part of this exclusive secretive club do with their garments.

 

 

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Re: Project Runway 5/30 - Back to Bravo - SPOILERS

@LoriLori @mtc @Icegoddess @dooBdoo @GoinBacktoCali 

 

Yes my repulsion was sumamrized very nicely by dooBdoo.The creation of the pieces are stunning and workmanship is second to none. It is the club and the pretentious vibe that irked me.