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gardenman · ‎03-09-2010

@123SuzyQ123 wrote:
@gardenman I was wondering --- does Kyland intend to take Derek F. or Azah to the Final 2 with him, or is there anyway of predicting what Kyland will do? LOL
Also, which of the Final 6 originally mentioned forming the Cookout, or did several of them stumble upon the idea together? Just wondering if there was ONE mastermind or how it came up that they wanted to make sure of a black winner this year? Thanks!

I think Kyland intends to take Xavier to the final two. He's talked a lot lately about "if you want to be the best, you've got to beat the best." Everyone tells him Xavier will win in the final two so he thinks it's better for him if he beats Xavier.

Derek F takes credit for everything in the game, but I'm not sure how much of the credit he deserves. Don't forget everything started out as teams this year and there was no Cookout team. They were all on separate teams and to a large extent playing for their teams early on. As individuals on teams, they had little control over the game. Derek F was most loyal to his teammates of Frenchie, Azah, and Britini. He's never liked or trusted Tiffany or Hannah. He did ally fairly early on with Xavier and Kyland, but he's wanted Tiffany and Hannah gone since week one.

There were roughly a gazillion alliances early on in the game with overlapping loyalties and memberships. You had final twos, final threes, final fives, and more. The Cookout was one of maybe twenty bigger alliances that were made. Many of which were fake just to survive week to week. Had nominations gone a different direction at any point the Cookout would have been one of the dozens of failed alliances we saw this year. They hung together long enough to get to the point where their numbers controlled the votes, but even then they needed some luck and HOH wins to ensure their safety.

Tiffany came up with the idea to pair up with a non-Cookout person, though Derek also claims credit for that. But had the Cookout imploded at any point, those pairs would have become the "real" alliance.

Every season we seem to get a "great" alliance that made it all the way to the end. But we have so many alliances form these days that one is bound to get to the end. It's largely just a question of which one avoids disaster along the way.

If you go back to week five when Derek X won power, he was part of a big, powerful alliance called the Royal Flush, with Sarah Beth, Christian, Tiffany, Xavier, Alyssa, Kyland, and Claire. They were set up to take out a non-Royal Flush member and SB wanted Hannah up and gone and others in the alliance wanted Derek F and Azah as the nominees. (The only choices outside the alliance were Azah, Derek F, Britini, and Hannah.)

Had Derek X stayed true to the Royal Flush, the six of them would now be in the final six and everyone would be talking about what a great alliance it was. Instead, he put up SB and then backdoored Christian, killing the Royal Flush. Every HOH since then (other than Hannah on the double eviction) has been a former member of the Royal Flush. Had that alliance stayed true, they'd be the alliance everyone was talking about steamrolling the game and being a great alliance.

The Cookout would be nothing but a vague memory at this stage of the game had the Royal Flush stayed true. Derek X flipping on his alliance created chaos and led to the Cookout getting to the end intact. It could have just as easily been the Royal Flush in the final six though. It could have been any of the many, many alliances formed this year. The Royal Flush was the best alliance. Everyone in it contributed wins and played well. They just turned on one another way too early in the game.

Fly!!! Eagles!!! Fly!!!

SusieQ_2 · ‎03-27-2012

Don't faint, lol, but I see it from a slightly different pov and have to take exception to this comment ~

"Every season we seem to get a "great" alliance that made it all the way to the end. But we have so many alliances form these days that one is bound to get to the end. It's largely just a question of which one avoids disaster along the way."

If what you're saying is a fraction of an alliance has made it all the way to the end then, yes, I agree. We have not, however, to my knowledge, had an alliance, and especially an alliance of six people, that made it all the way to the end intact. As well, with The CO it didn't come down to simply being able to avoid disaster along the way, it came down to actively sucking up their differences as well as planning and strategizing along the way so disaster didn't have the opportunity to break them up.

I'm not a BB historian, but I listen to a lot of different voices from the BB community because, for me, it's the only way to get a truly comprehensive perspective of the game. Two of those this season are Derrick Levasseur and Cody Califiore.

They have a podcast called The Winner's Circle where they spoke about The Cookout and its success in depth. Here are some of their comments starting with ~

"Six people, started at the beginning, made it to top six--never been done before."

That quote was taken from the podcast titled "The Cookout makes history and reaches final six." Here are some more in-depth quotes from that podcast~

First from Cody ~

"If you are willing to roll with people and even when you get in disagreements and even when they may push your buttons, even when you don't have the most trust, if you just stick with it and don't break loyalty--loyalty will get you to the end of the game and you saw it first hand with The Cookout. They refused, through their differences, through their animosity toward one another, through bickering like a family does, they refused to turn on each other and they refused to be denied of the goal they set out for and you saw it happen."

And from Derrick ~

"The Cookout had some good competitors. You have Tiffany, Xavier, Kyland and Hannah won a couple.

"The Cookout has to be considered one of, if not the greatest alliances of all time."

"Objectively speaking, from a statistical point of view, no one in the history of the show has done it better than The Cookout. That's a verifiable, undeniable fact. So, whether you like them or not, you gotta eat it because it's the truth."

"Here's the bottom lineIt's pretty objective, and it's fact based that of all the people that have attempted to do this large alliance strategy and get as far as they could from a statistical perspective, historically speaking, no one has done it better than The Cookout."

Cody ~ "Facts. And have your opinion or whatever but don't take away something based on an emotion, you know, something that may be an opinion of yours. You cannot deny what they have done."

Derrick ~ "Incredible. Hats off to you from the Hit Men."

Never hurts to hear it from another pov. Your opinion--the Royal Flush was the best alliance. My opinion--If they were the best they wouldn't have failed. One succeeded by their own will to make it and the other was fake. However, these are just differences in how we see things and I do respect your opinion.