Pet Lovers

[CrazyDaisy]

I am saddend how easily people give up when a situation does not go as expected.  How many times is this poor dog going to be bounced around.  Dogs can be trained, situations can be managed.  It does not have to be expensive training or putting anyone in dangerious situations.  Will it take some work, yes.

I have an older dog who frankly is not comfortable around other dogs and will act badly around them.  Well I got another dog knowing that it will not be easy.  She could and would hurt the puppy given the chance.  It took time slowly intruducing them and managing their interactions.   Not saying it was easy but I made a commitment.  They are now best friends.  Sometimes the right thing takes a little work. 

[CamilleP]

Daisy, if you have the space and time to manage a situation to protect the potential victim, then congratulations, but please don't assume everyone can.  The first rescue dog I fostered killed my neighbor's cat who snuck in my house, whom he did not recognize as one of "my cats".  The terrier urge to kill is strong and significant, and it is NOT something that can be "trained out" of them, if they view a cat as legit prey, they'll go for the kill every time they get a chance.  It's entirely possible that Tinkerbll44 may lose her cat if she persists in making the attempt to integrate the dog into her household.  How can she possibly ever love the dog who killed her cat?  I know I couldn't, and I wouldn't ask anyone else to, either, which is why I'm one of the voices urging caution in management of the situation until she can find a new home for this dog.  The shelter did not do it's job in evaluating this dog and informing potential adopters of his prey drive,  I don't think Tinkrbll44 is giving up easily, she's in a very bad situation she would never have volunteered for if the shelter had done it's job right.  If she, who is in that house watching those animals interact, feels that her cat's life is in danger, then I will not presume to second-guess her judgement, just support her and try to help her find tools to keep her cat safe until the danger is removed.

[CrazyDaisy]

---

@CamilleP wrote:

Daisy, if you have the space and time to manage a situation to protect the potential victim, then congratulations, but please don't assume everyone can.  The first rescue dog I fostered killed my neighbor's cat who snuck in my house, whom he did not recognize as one of "my cats".  The terrier urge to kill is strong and significant, and it is NOT something that can be "trained out" of them, if they view a cat as legit prey, they'll go for the kill every time they get a chance.  It's entirely possible that Tinkerbll44 may lose her cat if she persists in making the attempt to integrate the dog into her household.  How can she possibly ever love the dog who killed her cat?  I know I couldn't, and I wouldn't ask anyone else to, either, which is why I'm one of the voices urging caution in management of the situation until she can find a new home for this dog.  The shelter did not do it's job in evaluating this dog and informing potential adopters of his prey drive,  I don't think Tinkrbll44 is giving up easily, she's in a very bad situation she would never have volunteered for if the shelter had done it's job right.  If she, who is in that house watching those animals interact, feels that her cat's life is in danger, then I will not presume to second-guess her judgement, just support her and try to help her find tools to keep her cat safe until the danger is removed.

---

You are welcome to your opinion as am I.

 First, as stated before, not all shelters will cat test and even if they do it is no guarantee.  It is up to the person adopting to asses if it will be a good fit, not the other way around.

Second, we have no idea how these two were introduced.  Throwing any two animals together had hoping for the best is a ****** shoot.

Third, it has been a very short period of time.  A week or two is not enough time for the dog to settle in and learn the house rules.

Lastly everything is in her ooinion, not a professuional assessment?  The word "aggression" is used way to often.  Of course the new dog does not act like the old one.  The cat and new dog may just have two different ideas of what play is.  

And yes all dogs, even terriers can be trained what is appropiate behavior, if your willing to do the work.

[Tinkrbl44]

---

@CrazyDaisy wrote:

---

@CamilleP wrote:

Daisy, if you have the space and time to manage a situation to protect the potential victim, then congratulations, but please don't assume everyone can.  The first rescue dog I fostered killed my neighbor's cat who snuck in my house, whom he did not recognize as one of "my cats".  The terrier urge to kill is strong and significant, and it is NOT something that can be "trained out" of them, if they view a cat as legit prey, they'll go for the kill every time they get a chance.  It's entirely possible that Tinkerbll44 may lose her cat if she persists in making the attempt to integrate the dog into her household.  How can she possibly ever love the dog who killed her cat?  I know I couldn't, and I wouldn't ask anyone else to, either, which is why I'm one of the voices urging caution in management of the situation until she can find a new home for this dog.  The shelter did not do it's job in evaluating this dog and informing potential adopters of his prey drive,  I don't think Tinkrbll44 is giving up easily, she's in a very bad situation she would never have volunteered for if the shelter had done it's job right.  If she, who is in that house watching those animals interact, feels that her cat's life is in danger, then I will not presume to second-guess her judgement, just support her and try to help her find tools to keep her cat safe until the danger is removed.

---

You are welcome to your opinion as am I.

 First, as stated before, not all shelters will cat test and even if they do it is no guarantee.  It is up to the person adopting to asses if it will be a good fit, not the other way around.

Second, we have no idea how these two were introduced.  Throwing any two animals together had hoping for the best is a ****** shoot.

Third, it has been a very short period of time.  A week or two is not enough time for the dog to settle in and learn the house rules.

Lastly everything is in her ooinion, not a professuional assessment?  The word "aggression" is used way to often.  Of course the new dog does not act like the old one.  The cat and new dog may just have two different ideas of what play is.  

And yes all dogs, even terriers can be trained what is appropiate behavior, if your willing to do the work.

---

@CrazyDaisy     @CamilleP

Daisy, I understand what you're saying, but the dog was put in an area where we could spend time with him and he was calm, mellow and cuddly.   But that was with two people, not a cat.

When we got home, he chased the cat and has done a lot of barking ....  more than I'm confortable with.

Secondly, the shelter has a Ten Day Return Policy and the ten days are almost up.  

Yes, dogs can be trained, but some breeds are bred to be herders or chase small animals ....  and you CAN'T train instincts out of a dog.  You just can't.   

[CrazyDaisy]

---

@Tinkrbl44 wrote:

---

@CrazyDaisy wrote:

---

@CamilleP wrote:

Daisy, if you have the space and time to manage a situation to protect the potential victim, then congratulations, but please don't assume everyone can.  The first rescue dog I fostered killed my neighbor's cat who snuck in my house, whom he did not recognize as one of "my cats".  The terrier urge to kill is strong and significant, and it is NOT something that can be "trained out" of them, if they view a cat as legit prey, they'll go for the kill every time they get a chance.  It's entirely possible that Tinkerbll44 may lose her cat if she persists in making the attempt to integrate the dog into her household.  How can she possibly ever love the dog who killed her cat?  I know I couldn't, and I wouldn't ask anyone else to, either, which is why I'm one of the voices urging caution in management of the situation until she can find a new home for this dog.  The shelter did not do it's job in evaluating this dog and informing potential adopters of his prey drive,  I don't think Tinkrbll44 is giving up easily, she's in a very bad situation she would never have volunteered for if the shelter had done it's job right.  If she, who is in that house watching those animals interact, feels that her cat's life is in danger, then I will not presume to second-guess her judgement, just support her and try to help her find tools to keep her cat safe until the danger is removed.

---

You are welcome to your opinion as am I.

 First, as stated before, not all shelters will cat test and even if they do it is no guarantee.  It is up to the person adopting to asses if it will be a good fit, not the other way around.

Second, we have no idea how these two were introduced.  Throwing any two animals together had hoping for the best is a ****** shoot.

Third, it has been a very short period of time.  A week or two is not enough time for the dog to settle in and learn the house rules.

Lastly everything is in her ooinion, not a professuional assessment?  The word "aggression" is used way to often.  Of course the new dog does not act like the old one.  The cat and new dog may just have two different ideas of what play is.  

And yes all dogs, even terriers can be trained what is appropiate behavior, if your willing to do the work.

---

@CrazyDaisy     @CamilleP

Daisy, I understand what you're saying, but the dog was put in an area where we could spend time with him and he was calm, mellow and cuddly.   But that was with two people, not a cat.

When we got home, he chased the cat and has done a lot of barking ....  more than I'm confortable with.

Secondly, the shelter has a Ten Day Return Policy and the ten days are almost up.  

Yes, dogs can be trained, but some breeds are bred to be herders or chase small animals ....  and you CAN'T train instincts out of a dog.  You just can't.   

---

Two very simple solutions, leash the dog so he cannot chase till they get use to each other and you  teach him the "leave it:" command.  You just do not want it to work.

You have made up your mind that this dog is not the same as your other one and you don't want him.  Just admit it was too soon and you made the mistake rather than making excuses and blaming the dog.

[Tinkrbl44]

---

@CrazyDaisy wrote:

---

@Tinkrbl44 wrote:

---

@CrazyDaisy wrote:

---

@CamilleP wrote:

Daisy, if you have the space and time to manage a situation to protect the potential victim, then congratulations, but please don't assume everyone can.  The first rescue dog I fostered killed my neighbor's cat who snuck in my house, whom he did not recognize as one of "my cats".  The terrier urge to kill is strong and significant, and it is NOT something that can be "trained out" of them, if they view a cat as legit prey, they'll go for the kill every time they get a chance.  It's entirely possible that Tinkerbll44 may lose her cat if she persists in making the attempt to integrate the dog into her household.  How can she possibly ever love the dog who killed her cat?  I know I couldn't, and I wouldn't ask anyone else to, either, which is why I'm one of the voices urging caution in management of the situation until she can find a new home for this dog.  The shelter did not do it's job in evaluating this dog and informing potential adopters of his prey drive,  I don't think Tinkrbll44 is giving up easily, she's in a very bad situation she would never have volunteered for if the shelter had done it's job right.  If she, who is in that house watching those animals interact, feels that her cat's life is in danger, then I will not presume to second-guess her judgement, just support her and try to help her find tools to keep her cat safe until the danger is removed.

---

You are welcome to your opinion as am I.

 First, as stated before, not all shelters will cat test and even if they do it is no guarantee.  It is up to the person adopting to asses if it will be a good fit, not the other way around.

Second, we have no idea how these two were introduced.  Throwing any two animals together had hoping for the best is a ****** shoot.

Third, it has been a very short period of time.  A week or two is not enough time for the dog to settle in and learn the house rules.

Lastly everything is in her ooinion, not a professuional assessment?  The word "aggression" is used way to often.  Of course the new dog does not act like the old one.  The cat and new dog may just have two different ideas of what play is.  

And yes all dogs, even terriers can be trained what is appropiate behavior, if your willing to do the work.

---

@CrazyDaisy     @CamilleP

Daisy, I understand what you're saying, but the dog was put in an area where we could spend time with him and he was calm, mellow and cuddly.   But that was with two people, not a cat.

When we got home, he chased the cat and has done a lot of barking ....  more than I'm confortable with.

Secondly, the shelter has a Ten Day Return Policy and the ten days are almost up.  

Yes, dogs can be trained, but some breeds are bred to be herders or chase small animals ....  and you CAN'T train instincts out of a dog.  You just can't.   

---

Two very simple solutions, leash the dog so he cannot chase till they get use to each other and you  teach him the "leave it:" command.  You just do not want it to work.

You have made up your mind that this dog is not the same as your other one and you don't want him.  Just admit it was too soon and you made the mistake rather than making excuses and blaming the dog.

---

@CrazyDaisy

Oh good grief ....   You are 100% WRONG on this.    I am not "blaming the dog".   He's a real cutie pie, but I think this is not the right home-match for this dog.  The perfect home for Teddy would be where he is the only pet in the household.

My feeling is that if a dog isn't working out initially it's better to get him back to the shelter for adopting, rather than keep him for 3 to 6 months, hoping to break bad habits,  and then end up taking him back anyway.

I just spoke with the manager of the shelter and she also said some dogs will always chase cats, and if they don't grow up with them, it can be next to impossible to break them of the habit, even with training.   Teddy is 3 years old and was picked up as a stray.

We also had a trainer in last Saturday but Teddy had chased Bogey earlier that day and Bogey wouldn't come out from under the bed the whole time the trainer was here.     

We are debating whether more training will make any difference.   

[CamilleP]

Daisy, it's pretty clear you've never lived with a "hard" terrier.  Every individual is a little different, but without knowing this particular dog and this particular cat, I will always defer to the person who is living with them.  Given that this particular cat is so afraid of this particular dog that he is hiding under beds, I completely support Tinkrbll44 in her assesssment and decision that this dog is not a good fit in her family.

[CrazyDaisy]

---

@CamilleP wrote:

Daisy, it's pretty clear you've never lived with a "hard" terrier.  Every individual is a little different, but without knowing this particular dog and this particular cat, I will always defer to the person who is living with them.  Given that this particular cat is so afraid of this particular dog that he is hiding under beds, I completely support Tinkrbll44 in her assesssment and decision that this dog is not a good fit in her family.

---

Have a staffy at home right now.

Oh and I agree with the decision, just for an entirely different reason.

[CamilleP]

Well, the bull&terrier breeds are considerably more trainable and less prey-driven than the pure terriers, so you are lucky there.  That infusion of old English bulldog blood gives the bull&terrier a desire to please their human that the pure terriers just don't have; with those stubborn boogers it's "Talk to the Paw" unless they are well and truly bored and doing literally nothing else, or if you have a high-value treat in your hand.  Their attention span lasts exactly as long as there is a morsel un-consumed, when the last calorie is inhaled, it's "Talk to the Paw" again, LOL!

[CrazyDaisy]

---

@CamilleP wrote:

Well, the bull&terrier breeds are considerably more trainable and less prey-driven than the pure terriers, so you are lucky there.  That infusion of old English bulldog blood gives the bull&terrier a desire to please their human that the pure terriers just don't have; with those stubborn boogers it's "Talk to the Paw" unless they are well and truly bored and doing literally nothing else, or if you have a high-value treat in your hand.  Their attention span lasts exactly as long as there is a morsel un-consumed, when the last calorie is inhaled, it's "Talk to the Paw" again, LOL!

Following your logic the mix with a pug will make the dog much more trainable, correct.

I find it funny how you say they are eager to please and trainable yet when conversations goes to pit bulls they turn into baby killers and should all be banned.  Mine is a mix, staffy, border collie and probably whippet.  Lots of drive there.  

I have friends who have Jack Russel terriers (3) and foster cats for the shelter. Several others with border collies and australian shepherds who have house cats. It is not impossible but does make a good excuse.