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Honored Contributor
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Registered: ‎03-10-2010

Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry


@NickNack wrote:

@Drythe wrote:

@NickNack wrote:

@goldensrbest wrote:

@NickNack wrote:

@goldensrbest wrote:

Is there any chance that ava ,had at any point been abused in the past?


 

 

@goldensrbest   I have wondered that and mentioned it to her breeder.  The breeder that I got her from bred her and kept her as a puppy.  At one point she sold her to another breeder and then eventually got her back.  The original breeder who I got her from said that she trusted the other breeder but later found out that her husband was unstable.  I think he must have mistreated her in some way.


I think that is a  possibility, there are temped dogs, i had one ,but fearful ,i think is different.


 

 

@goldensrbest   I do think it's a real possibility, too.  What is a "temped dog"?  I think it's probably a typo but couldn't come up with the word that you meant.


@NickNack 

 

Timid ?

 

Hope all is well.


 

Thank you @Drythe !  I'm sure you are correct.


YES,TIMID.

When you lose some one you L~O~V~E, that Memory of them, becomes a TREASURE.
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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry


@Silver Lining wrote:

@NickNack wrote:

@goldensrbest wrote:

Is there any chance that ava ,had at any point been abused in the past?


 

 

@goldensrbest   I have wondered that and mentioned it to her breeder.  The breeder that I got her from bred her and kept her as a puppy.  At one point she sold her to another breeder and then eventually got her back.  The original breeder who I got her from said that she trusted the other breeder but later found out that her husband was unstable.  I think he must have mistreated her in some way.


 

@Nicknack, I think Ava has had a stressful life from the beginning. I'm not implying anything about the breeder. I'm just wondering how she obtained Ava in the first place. Was she born there or did the breeder buy her from somewhere else? Nonetheless, the intention was to breed her to sell her puppies which I guess were taken from her. For some reason after that the breeder sold Ava to another breeder. Later she bought(?) her back. To me, that's a lot for any dog to endure, especially one who was used for breeding. She's only three and a half now and in another home.

 

Please don't think I'm dissing the lady who gave Ava to you. I just feel that she might have a guilty conscience to some degree about how Ava was handled. She knew Ava was suffering and that is the reason she ended up giving Ava to you. She could tell that you are sincere and will love and take care of her the way she deserves. I think Ava will eventually feel secure but I think she will probably always have some issues with it due to her beginnings. Dogs will have reactions to previous bad situations years afterwards even though they are eventually in a stable environment. 

 

I think you are a wonderful mom for Ava. She'll adjust to bring around Henry. It might not be a love-connnection but it will be okay. 


 

 

@Silver Lining   Thank you.  I think Ava was under stress at her breeder's home, too, with the other dogs.  She was fine much of the time, but it was too much for her at other times.  The breeder told me that.  She was born at the breeder's house that I got her from.  She never had puppies.  The breeder told me that, and I have her Vet records.  She tried to show her, but she was scared of the show ring, so she didn't.

 

The breeder had a cat, and she said Ava ignored her cat.  I thought it would be the same with Henry.  If she and Henry are never friends that will be fine.  I just don't want her to be afraid of Henry.


Day after day the whole day through, wherever my road inclined, four feet said 'I'm coming with you!' and trotted along behind. Kipling





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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

[ Edited ]

@SeaMaiden wrote:

@NickNack   It has been only eleven days!  Give the dog 6 months A LEAST to acclimate and feel safe. Eleven days is nothing when you adopt a dog who was most likely abused or miss treated .....she just needs lots of time. Please do not rush her. 


 

 

@SeaMaiden   I don't feel that I'm forcing her.  I just am trying to help her not be afraid of Henry.  I'm definitely not putting them together or forcing anything.  I felt like by getting a trainer in to help me a couple of times might keep it from getting worse.  She has definitely told me some things to do and not to do that make a lot of sense.

 

The reason I'm doing this is because I had a dog one time who was an older rescue.  He was definitely not abused but had never been around cats.  I had three cats and he chased them every time they came around.  It never got better.  I don't want Ava to be afraid of Henry forever and would like to help that not happen.  I'm really not trying to force anything and will not give up on her.  I love her very much already.


Day after day the whole day through, wherever my road inclined, four feet said 'I'm coming with you!' and trotted along behind. Kipling





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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry


@GOLDIEANDEDDY wrote:

I wish I could help you, but can only say, imho, time:  when Ava's ready to come around she will and the less notice taken, the better.

 

When I got Eddy, he was only four years old.  (The rescue had told me he was ten and since I had to contact the hospital he had been treated in a couple times I found out they only guessed 'cause his mouth was so damaged.)  Anyways, Eddy was terrified of any and everyone who would come here to the point that I kept the swifter wetjet out if ya know   what I mean.  He was on many meds and was supposed to bedrest (actually be crated, but he was afraid of crates) so we just hung together kind of.

 

Then suddenly one day when he met his fifth visitor, he greeted his "auntie" - a friend of mine from work.  Could be that she was never a dog person, except for my Jade.  Perhaps Eddy sensed it.  But that was the day the swifter was no longer required.  I think Eddy just had to accept people on his timeline.  And, I think Ava will accept Henry on her timeline.  

 

'I'd just keep them in the same room with you at the same time, acting as if everything is normal and well; maintaining a conversation with the two of them, treating them equally perhaps the three of you sitting on the floor together sharing treats chips, cheese, whatever.  The food and conversation bring people together. it just might bring these special furbabies together also.

 

So, though long-winded(sorry), I think just acting matter-of-factly, like all is fine and coming together munching - who doesn't like a treat-  or reading  aloud to them, or just talking to them, letting them know how special they both are to you.  And, they might enjoy their "tea-time" together with momma!

 

Sorry about the print change - this laptop does strange things.

 

By the way. Eddy LOVES people - all people!  If a stranger comes here, e.g. delivery man, he'll run to greet them!!  He loves to kiss people and snuggle:  he even kissed his vet when she gave him his required shots!!  I'm sure in time - not that much time most likely, Ava will be snuggling with Henry.HeartHeart

 

 


 

 

@GOLDIEANDEDDY   It sounds like Eddy made remarkable progress in a relatively short time.  He sounds like a very special dog.  I hope the same for Ava.

 

If it takes a while for Ava that's fine.  I just hate to see her so scared.  I don't think she senses any stress in me, and I remain very calm around them.  I'm only trying to help her.


Day after day the whole day through, wherever my road inclined, four feet said 'I'm coming with you!' and trotted along behind. Kipling





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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

@NickNack 

 

It sounds like both of them are wary one another.  I would not assume this is all Ava's fear of Henry and not a little in reverse.  Henry had a quiet home with you to himself for a little while and now he, too, must accommodate this new dog. How much has he come around you since Ava came home?  I thought he would be affectionate with you "pre" Ava--is this still happening?

 

Cats hate change and they stress out big time when they sense a change in affections. They don't understand that we can love both dogs and cats. They don't 'bark but they show it in quiet ways.  I'm certain they are sensing the stress on each of them--this is probably worth mentioning to the trainer.  Or, read up on some of Jackson Galaxy's advice on integrating a new dog into the home where the cat is the "senior" pet.

 

If Henry is stressed, as he most assuredly is, it will affect Ava and vice versa. They need equal, one-on-one loving attention from you.  It sounds like Ava has had a long hard road of bouncing around with these various breeders and it will take a long time for her to realize she's not going anywhere.  Months, not weeks or days.  

 

She and Henry are in the best possible, the most loving home possible. 

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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

@NickNack  I know Ava and Henry will be able to live peacefully together eventually.  Your kindness and patience are just wonderful.  

Once Ava comes to understand Henry is not a threat and that she is safe and in a stable environment I think she'll be fine.

Trees are the lungs of the Earth
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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

@Sammycat1   Thanks for your input.  I'm not sure how Henry feels about Ava.  I have observed him going up to her and sniffing her.  Today when I was trying to get her to walk down the hall with me while Henry was sitting at the door (I was using peanut butter on a long spoon and letting her lick it as the trainer had showed me) he moved toward her as we got closer.  Ava then went farther away from him.  I didn't pursue it.  I'm not sure what he was going to do.  I will tell the trainer I'm not sure about Henry.  That's a good idea.

 

Henry is still affectionate with me.  He sits on my lap at least twice a day like he always has.  He sits near me or on the table right beside me.  I pet him all the time, and he likes it.  I did notice for a while he wasn't coming around as often.  That only lasted a few days.

 

When I'm sitting in my bed watching TV he always comes and sits on the bed with me.  Yesterday Ava and I were on the bed, and he came and sat on my lap.  Then he moved closer to Ava.  She moved away from him but didn't ask to get down. This happens frequently.

 

I definitely try to pay as much attention to him as I do to Ava.  It was his house first.  Today is the 13th day since I've had her.  I know this will take time.  Ava has been with two breeders--her original breeder and another one for a short amount of time.  

 

I mainly hired the trainer so that I would know what to do and what not to do.  I do think she will help with that.  It seemed like we made a lot of progress while she was here, but when she left it reverted back to the way it was.

 

I am sure it will take months and not weeks.  I was hoping for weeks.  I don't want either one of them to be scared or uneasy in their own home.  I plan on being very patient.

 

 

 


Day after day the whole day through, wherever my road inclined, four feet said 'I'm coming with you!' and trotted along behind. Kipling





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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

@NickNack 

 

Even though it may be a long haul, these two have the best chance for happiness in your home.


Just an aside, when we had to integrate dogs with cats, we fed them at the same time and gave them treats at the same time. This also helped.

 

Good luck!

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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

[ Edited ]

@Sammycat1 wrote:

@NickNack 

 

Even though it may be a long haul, these two have the best chance for happiness in your home.


Just an aside, when we had to integrate dogs with cats, we fed them at the same time and gave them treats at the same time. This also helped.

 

Good luck!


 

 

@Sammycat1   Thank you.  Ava is a very finicky eater.  She eats Wellness kibble and Fresh Pet chicken and vegetables (in refrigerated section of Target and some other places).  She loves the Fresh Pet and does eat the Wellness, too.  Sometimes she only eats a few bites though.  Sometimes she doesn't eat at all.  I'm hoping this will get better with time, but I'm not sure it will.

 

Henry is interested in the Fresh Pet, so I couldn't feed them at the same time.  He wouldn't eat his own food.  I free feed him and keep his food on the bathroom counter.  I've always done this with the cat food so that the dogs couldn't eat it.

 

Ava is very motivated by praise but not by treats.  She does like peanut butter though.  Henry hasn't eaten any treats I've tried with him.


Day after day the whole day through, wherever my road inclined, four feet said 'I'm coming with you!' and trotted along behind. Kipling





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Re: Ava Is Terrified Of Henry

@NickNack 

 

Well maybe "dual praise" sessions will work with them--I'm sure you'll devise a routine that makes everyone comfortable.

 

Frankie the cat, who you know well, and her "sister" Fay Wray endured living in a hoarder's ranch-style home with 100 other cats. They had to learn to stand on their back legs to find food, like prairie dogs, because there was so much trash in the house. There were dead animals in there, too. Once the SPCA seized the animals, they went to a shelter for 2 years, crammed in a cage together, then to our shelter for a year--where we found them.

 

They were nervous wrecks with a zillion health issues but mostly terrified of people. We decided to take them on. They cried the whole way home from the shelter. Our regular vet didn't think they'd survive long from the stress and its impact on their health.

 

Frankie stayed under our couch for a week straight, coming out only at night to use the litter box. She ate all her meals under the couch...usually with Fay Wray by her side.  Then one day, Fay Wray's nose poked out...then Frankie's. They walked around the living room, then went right back under the couch. 

 

This went on for a month. Finally, they gradually stayed out from under the couch more and more time.  Two months later, they came out for good. And they went from there to demanding to sleep with us on the bed!  We were "approved."

 

So patience and love and kindess--and you have all these in abundance. That's the wondrous thing about animals; they can trust again.  Heart