Community Chat

[Sunnyfield]

Just a couple of comments...

First of all, I am almost 70 and clearly remember calling in sick on a Friday or a Monday to take advantage of a long weekend...not many times but I have done it...and so have many people I know...it's not just millenial issue...it's an immaturity issue...

My son who is now 30 got fired from a couple of jobs for being late too often, etc. etc.

Around the age of 26 he got things together and is now in a management position with a major corporation...and HE complains about the work ethic of many millenials.

So I actually do believe it is largely an immaturity issue...

Also, the "let's sue them" mentality is rampant in our society...everyone and anyone sues over the slightest thing so it's no surprise to me that young people in the workforce think being denied something is an unfair employment practice...again...immaturity and what they have seen in society...

Just my two cents...

[Spurt]

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@AuntG wrote:

@Spurt, where do these people who say "it's always been this way" come from? When I started my job, we followed every company policy or knew we wouldn't have a job. Even growing up on a farm, we accepted that there would be no summer vacation because that was our busiest time. To this day, I sell vacation days back to my company. My boss even attended a seminar about the generational differences because we can't get the young workers to think beyond "what's in it for me".

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@AuntG

Hi AUNTG!!!  Its a totally different world today, and I'm sorry but I think there is also a difference in maturity level, or perhaps what our parents or grandparents taught us starting when we were kids. No one handed us things.  I can relate to your work on a farm, but I bet you worked much harder than I had to, but I had to babysit or mow lawns or clean my aunt's house to earn money for the "fun stuff"---as a young kid-for that special toy, as a teen---movie tickets, music, makeup, magazines etc.....Teenagers werent automatically given a car, along with gas money needed to run it, we took the school bus,   We didnt know the meaning of entitlement!  These lessons were expanded on what needed to be done to get ahead in life, successful career, a home etc.....these aren't handed to you...you gotta work hard and earn it!   Young people today may be geniuses when it comes to electronics, but sadly they lack some life skills and maturity for sure! JMHO!  So I definitely see why your boss had to attend that generational difference seminar---much needed.  Even advertisers and marketing folks had to change their points of few as well...you see it all around us....

[QVCkitty1]

Ok, there has been a lot of back and forth here, and we all have different backgrounds and experiences. But here is one last story from me. A very smart and able young man was giving anesthesia in my OR and he had bee reprimanded several times for going in the room computer, ( this was a couple of years before each machine had their own ) . Anyway he wasn't paying attention on one occasion and almost made a fatal mistake. He lost his job, and his career. Tech is useful, and fun, timing is everything. You are not paid to look at Facebook or YouTube etc.

[Blahblahvampemer]

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@Spurt wrote:

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@Blahblahvampemer wrote:

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@mistriTsquirrel wrote:

These days, "entry-level" jobs often require a bachelor's or master's degree.  When you think about it, the fact that one would have to attend school for 4-6 years after high school to get a job that someone out of high school used to be able to get is pretty irritating.  I think the mindset is that those 4-6 years were the "dues" they were supposed to be paying, and when will the work they put in start to pay off.

My mother got a job as an accountant with a high school diploma, by "working her way up" (and it didn't take 4 years).  That would never happen these days.  These days, a person would have to go to college for 4 years to even have a chance at getting that exact same job title...if they beat out 200 other applicants.

The gripes may seem petty, but the feeling is that the work is neverending with not much reward in sight.  In other words, "if I have to cover the amount of work that used to be done by 3 people (for the same wage), can I at least have access to Facebook?"

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This is true up to a point, but I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that 50 years ago, middle schoolers knew more than today's high school and even college grads.  People used to pay for school so they really thought of how much AND what classes will really help them get ahead.  One of the creators of Common Core talked about minimizing math skills, and yet what is a huge complaint of employers?  Applicants don't have the math skills.

My dad taught in the technical area, and he worked closely with the needs of employers as to how the program was shaped, but the quality of students drastically declined in the 90s.  As frustrating as administrative baloney can be, every teacher I know was mostly sickened by the lack of college-ready students.  We have the most expensive education system in the world, and we get some of the worst results.  What in the heck are they teaching if reading, writing, grammar, math, civics and finance are being minimized?

I've found that there are a lot of employers who don't want or need a college degree, but they do demand experience.  One of the most successful people I know started working an entry-level job at 18, and if she'd stayed in that particular field, she'd be making around 60+ K just because the experience is viewed as better than a degree.  Getting out of college prepares you for flipping burgers unless the field is in demand.  Even then, it doesn't mean you'll do well on the job if you're lacking the soft skills or feel entitled.

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@Blahblahvampemer

Well said!  A degree isnt much worth the paper its printed on today....employers are looki for different skillsets and maturity that college doesn't teach these days!

Yep, math, grammar, cursive writing, ....all ditched in favor of graduating without having learned critical skills.  This may be considered ancient but one of the best classes I took in high school back in the 70's (I already had the credits needed to graduate and for college) I signed up for what I thought was an easy "A" was something called "Personal Math" what this course did was to teach how to set up a budget---bill paying, saving and investing for the future, ---a real LIFE SKILLS class, I thouht to myself this should be mandatory like civics. best class I took in high school.....I recommended it to all, but sadly they did away with it!

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My dad still says that one of the most important classes he ever took as an undergrad in the mid 50s was logic.  I would say finance, statistics, economics and distribution channels really made me think. Brava for taking that class!  It couldn't be more needed but is sadly long gone.

[Spurt]

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@Noel7 wrote:

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@Spurt wrote:

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@Noel7 wrote:

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@Spurt wrote:

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@Abrowneyegirl wrote:

@Spurt

I like your example and am going to share it with the other mentors.

"Totally agree and to put it in another perspective...How would THEY feel if their smartphone, smartTV, or internet required repair, and the person repairing their items wasn't working and instead was playing on their phone, but charging THEM per hour???????????????????????"

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@Abrowneyegirl @Noel7

Glad the example.....glad I could help....

I'm not saying that all millenials are awful people, their perspective on the real world isn't accurate though....  I'll give you an example, a friend's daughter is 24, always been a hard worker, when going to college she worked part-time jobs---she even didnt mind working nights and weekends when the rest of her friends were partying.....However, she did get fired on one for job for.....guess what....being on her cell phone (even though she finished her work).....And even now that she has graduated from college and has a good, excellent salary and benefits, she gets in trouble for taking too long lunch hours, and she has come in late to work because what was she doing ....she was up all night texting with her friends so she didn't hear the alarm.  She works hard and has to work lots of overtime during her companies businest times, and she does that well and never complains, she's a good kid, .(she even enjoys hainging out with us "crazy old ladies") but we try to mentor her and tell her to keep her phone in perspective and put her job first, good jobs are hard to find these days.....

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@Spurt

I know you aren't saying they're all awful. SPURT, but we do see attacks on them every day on Chat.

I know you understand we can't judge a generation on the one or two any of us know personally.

A couple of decades ago, we brought a troubled young teen into our home.  We took care of her over the years and I tried to teach her many things.  She was a handful, including some drugs and incredibly lazy.  She pretty much blew every job she got because she didn't want to follow the rules.

Today she is a department head for a major international company and speaks several languages.  Even I wouldn't have predicted the success she was able to achieve.

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@Noel7

I understand what your saying....I'm not judging based or one or two....I'm basing this on a whole office/company's experience....and from personal experience....even a hard working yp...............

Given the right upbringing or in your situationa, mentorship, if an individual's is willing to listen, learn and to change then certainly success can be experienced but it requires a change in attitude and perspective on life in general.....

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You're right @Spurt  It sure does!  Usually, that happens naturally.  Remember, all studies show the brain of a young person is not fully developed until age 25, give or take a little.  Obviously, some never mature, but thankfully, most young people do, including the millennials.

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@Noel7

You did a great job with that young person and really helped to turn her life around--I congratulate you on changing a life for the better.....

I just think there is a bigger learning curve required for the change in maturity and attitude..........

Take Care Hope you have a good day!

[AuntG]

@Noel7 was I addressing you, not really? I was just reading along and decided to comment.  The person who I remember disagreeing with was named Crystaltree but I knew there were others too.  My point is that if companies have to conduct seminars to deal with wimpy kids, it's a real issue.  After WWII, I doubt if bosses had to take a class on dealing with vets.  Those people just wanted a job to care for their families.

[Spurt]

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@Blahblahvampemer wrote:

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@Noel7 wrote:

IT'S ALWAYS BEEN THAT WAY

Please, stop with the incessant attacks on younger people.

It was that way decades ago when I got my first professional job.  People complained about not being able to use the phones for private calls, and we had a group protest so women could wear pants suits to work.

This is nothing new.

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No, it wasn't always that way.  In the late 70s, I saw students come into my program ready to kick educational backside, no remedial courses required, and they finished on the expected timetable with multiple job offers waiting.  Now they require an average of six months remedial, and the drop-out rate has soared.  I took a one-year course that started with 17 students and ended with two.  I was one of them.  

It used to be common for MOST teens to have already worked before they went to college, but now we have college grads that have NEVER held a job. Scary.

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@Blahblahvampemer

Some of them don't work at all, which holds them back in the maturity level, instead they live off student loans and end up with a mountain of debt looking for a job.........to play off Martha Stewart's mantra...."that's NOT a good thing"!

[Noel7]

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@AuntG wrote:

@Noel7 was I addressing you, not really? I was just reading along and decided to comment.  The person who I remember disagreeing with was named Crystaltree but I knew there were others too.  My point is that if companies have to conduct seminars to deal with wimpy kids, it's a real issue.  After WWII, I doubt if bosses had to take a class on dealing with vets.  Those people just wanted a job to care for their families.

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@AuntG

Yes, you were referring to me.  I'm the one who said it's always been that way, and that's what you quoted.

You asked where I came from and I told you.  You made it personal.  Obviously I worked my backside off, I don't know what you expected. apparently that I was a sloth.

[Noel7]

Nice talking to you @Spurt

I'm going elsewhere, not strong enough today to handle personal attacks.