Community Chat

[SuhseK]

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@Sage04 wrote:

@Icegoddess  I heard that a few months ago and I thought that it was not fair. Is it because they can´t pinpoint what did it or because it´s easier to say that?

The same with Aids. Oh the person had Aids but he/she died from Pneumonia.

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The AIDS virus, didn't actually kill anyone. What it did, was destroy the victims immune system, so that they died from 

other diseases, pneumonia, being a common cause of death. 

Let's say someone has terminal cancer, with widespread metastasis.  One day, they collapse, and die, with a massive stroke. Did the stroke kill them, or did cancer, which, had also metastasized, to the brain? 

Chances are, the cause of death will be stroke, with underlying metastatic cancer.  Causes of dearth, are not always cut and dry simple.  

[Icegoddess]

@Drythe regardless of where the news article came from, the quote from my state's Department of Public Health still applies.  You can believe it or not.  If you are in a car accident and die from your injuries but have tested positive for Covid-19 you are counted as a Covid-19 death.  That's not from the news article.  That's from her own lips.

[Wsmom]

@bikerbabe , am I mistaken or are you the one who just got her nursing license in the last couple of years?  It seems like yesterday but it is probably a couple of years ago now.  I only mention because if so, what an introduction to your new profession!  Regardless thank you for all you do.  I just can't imagine what you all are going through.

[pigletsmom]

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@Deree wrote:

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@pigletsmom wrote:

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@Deree wrote:

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@deedledeedeedle wrote:

Or to get more tax dollars for your state $$$$$$$

Kaboom.

Why do you think some governors made it law that nursing homes must accept discharged Covid patients? Just because a relatively healthy person resides in a nursing home does not make them less valuable and only useful as a death statistic. The death rate upticks mean more payola for the state. Chilling, I know. I despise every governor that did this. The purpose of setting up field hospitals was for the long term recovery of non acute, recovering Covid patients, and NOT to discharge a patient to a nursing home full of vulnerable folks. Meanwhile, the three field hospitals set up nearby me with 3,500 beds (paid for with tax dollars) sat empty.

dee

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As I understood it the state you are probably referring to followed the fed's CDC guidelines in March that "a nursing home cannot discriminate against a Covid positive person" and must accept them back into their facility. However, they were not to take in a Covid positive patient if they couldn’t maintain a safe environment for the patient and other residents.  If they were unable to maintain proper protocol and meet safety guidelines for all concerned they were to contact the Dept. of Health and the patient would have been transferred elsewhere. I hear a lot of people yelling Why weren't these patients sent to the field hospitals? The field hospitals were set up after it became apparent that the nursing homes weren't able to control and contain the virus within their facility(ies).  

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Nursing homes were denied help when they asked for it. The weren't even allowed to ask if someone was positive. They weren't allowed to test anyone before they came into the nursing home. The state didn't help them get PPE  The above response sounds like it came right out of the Governor's office.  

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I don't know if what you're saying is so.  Some people hear things then run with it.  Before you know it many others join in and it becomes a Truth and a bashfest of a particular state or governor.  That's what I hate most about the way information is being disseminated in this pandemic and how people will believe what they want to believe based upon reading something or hearing something.  Their biases will tend to determine what they choose to believe.  Just speaking in general here.  But I posted what I believe is the Truth.  YMMV.

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Yes there's bad information all the time. I unfortunately live minutes away from the Governor and we do have a good press corp but they don't get a lot of attention. I have followed this closely and even gave the Governor credit in the beginning of this mess, even though in general I'm not a fan. There are emails to back up the nursing home stuff and he admitted to not helping with PPE and tried to blow it off. 

The truth is they were super hyper about clearing space in the hospital so if you were considered well enough to go home you did. Unfortunately if home meant a nursing home so be it. Pretty outrageous since we already knew that a nursing home got close to wiped out in Washington State.

[Deree]

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@pigletsmom wrote:

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@Deree wrote:

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@pigletsmom wrote:

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@Deree wrote:

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@deedledeedeedle wrote:

Or to get more tax dollars for your state $$$$$$$

Kaboom.

Why do you think some governors made it law that nursing homes must accept discharged Covid patients? Just because a relatively healthy person resides in a nursing home does not make them less valuable and only useful as a death statistic. The death rate upticks mean more payola for the state. Chilling, I know. I despise every governor that did this. The purpose of setting up field hospitals was for the long term recovery of non acute, recovering Covid patients, and NOT to discharge a patient to a nursing home full of vulnerable folks. Meanwhile, the three field hospitals set up nearby me with 3,500 beds (paid for with tax dollars) sat empty.

dee

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As I understood it the state you are probably referring to followed the fed's CDC guidelines in March that "a nursing home cannot discriminate against a Covid positive person" and must accept them back into their facility. However, they were not to take in a Covid positive patient if they couldn’t maintain a safe environment for the patient and other residents.  If they were unable to maintain proper protocol and meet safety guidelines for all concerned they were to contact the Dept. of Health and the patient would have been transferred elsewhere. I hear a lot of people yelling Why weren't these patients sent to the field hospitals? The field hospitals were set up after it became apparent that the nursing homes weren't able to control and contain the virus within their facility(ies).  

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Nursing homes were denied help when they asked for it. The weren't even allowed to ask if someone was positive. They weren't allowed to test anyone before they came into the nursing home. The state didn't help them get PPE  The above response sounds like it came right out of the Governor's office.  

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I don't know if what you're saying is so.  Some people hear things then run with it.  Before you know it many others join in and it becomes a Truth and a bashfest of a particular state or governor.  That's what I hate most about the way information is being disseminated in this pandemic and how people will believe what they want to believe based upon reading something or hearing something.  Their biases will tend to determine what they choose to believe.  Just speaking in general here.  But I posted what I believe is the Truth.  YMMV.

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Yes there's bad information all the time. I unfortunately live minutes away from the Governor and we do have a good press corp but they don't get a lot of attention. I have followed this closely and even gave the Governor credit in the beginning of this mess, even though in general I'm not a fan. There are emails to back up the nursing home stuff and he admitted to not helping with PPE and tried to blow it off. 

The truth is they were super hyper about clearing space in the hospital so if you were considered well enough to go home you did. Unfortunately if home meant a nursing home so be it. Pretty outrageous since we already knew that a nursing home got close to wiped out in Washington State.

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And I was never ever a fan of his until recently.  So there you have it.  I guess you have your info and I have mine.

[stevieb]

Well, we can start with integrity, work our way past accuracy, and then go from there... And then, darn it, there's that whole bias thing...

[chiclets]

Um...

When you die, you are dead.

Everyone dies from something.

When you die you become a part of some statical number data system.

Arguing the numbers actually caused by Covid-19 is a moot argument.

Dead is dead.

[esmerelda]

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@Deree wrote:

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@deedledeedeedle wrote:

Or to get more tax dollars for your state $$$$$$$

Kaboom.

Why do you think some governors made it law that nursing homes must accept discharged Covid patients? Just because a relatively healthy person resides in a nursing home does not make them less valuable and only useful as a death statistic. The death rate upticks mean more payola for the state. Chilling, I know. I despise every governor that did this. The purpose of setting up field hospitals was for the long term recovery of non acute, recovering Covid patients, and NOT to discharge a patient to a nursing home full of vulnerable folks. Meanwhile, the three field hospitals set up nearby me with 3,500 beds (paid for with tax dollars) sat empty.

dee

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As I understood it the state you are probably referring to followed the fed's CDC guidelines in March that "a nursing home cannot discriminate against a Covid positive person" and must accept them back into their facility. However, they were not to take in a Covid positive patient if they couldn’t maintain a safe environment for the patient and other residents.  If they were unable to maintain proper protocol and meet safety guidelines for all concerned they were to contact the Dept. of Health and the patient would have been transferred elsewhere. I hear a lot of people yelling Why weren't these patients sent to the field hospitals? The field hospitals were set up after it became apparent that the nursing homes weren't able to control and contain the virus within their facility(ies).  

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The nursing homes didn't want the covid patients back and pushed back against having to take them

If they were willing to take covid-positive patients, why did the facilities close to resident/patient families and visitors to prevent the disease from coming inside?

[Deree]

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@esmerelda wrote:

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@Deree wrote:

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@deedledeedeedle wrote:

Or to get more tax dollars for your state $$$$$$$

Kaboom.

Why do you think some governors made it law that nursing homes must accept discharged Covid patients? Just because a relatively healthy person resides in a nursing home does not make them less valuable and only useful as a death statistic. The death rate upticks mean more payola for the state. Chilling, I know. I despise every governor that did this. The purpose of setting up field hospitals was for the long term recovery of non acute, recovering Covid patients, and NOT to discharge a patient to a nursing home full of vulnerable folks. Meanwhile, the three field hospitals set up nearby me with 3,500 beds (paid for with tax dollars) sat empty.

dee

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As I understood it the state you are probably referring to followed the fed's CDC guidelines in March that "a nursing home cannot discriminate against a Covid positive person" and must accept them back into their facility. However, they were not to take in a Covid positive patient if they couldn’t maintain a safe environment for the patient and other residents.  If they were unable to maintain proper protocol and meet safety guidelines for all concerned they were to contact the Dept. of Health and the patient would have been transferred elsewhere. I hear a lot of people yelling Why weren't these patients sent to the field hospitals? The field hospitals were set up after it became apparent that the nursing homes weren't able to control and contain the virus within their facility(ies).  

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The nursing homes didn't want the covid patients back and pushed back against having to take them

If they were willing to take covid-positive patients, why did the facilities close to resident/patient families and visitors to prevent the disease from coming inside?

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Again. If the nursing homes didn't want covid patients back because they didn't have the ability to care for them then they were to contact the Dept. of Health.  If it was determined that the nursing home didn't want to take a covid patient back but did have the capability to take care of them that would be deemed discrimination according to the fed's CDC guidelines.  As to which reason it actually was in any particular case I don't think you or I really know.  Some people will have heard or read it one way and other people will have heard or read it another way. 

Your second sentence doesn't make any sense to me. Perhaps I am misunderstanding it.  If you have covid patients in a facility you do not allow visitors inside just the same exact way hospitals do not allow visitors to covid patients.

[esmerelda]

@Deree  Timeline.  Nursing homes were closed to visitors/family in the beginning to keep the disease out. Brought in by staff?  So staff stays away while ill. And the nursing home brings in covid patients?  In what world does that make sense?

Also, doesn't governor have power over health department?

It's common sense and decency. Do what you can to protect everyone.  Where there's a will, there's a way. 

Who thinks anyone in charge would return their own loved one to a nursing home in the same way?