Community Chat

[just bee]

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@bikerbabe wrote:

He was the best thing to happen to the church in a very long time.💕

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@bikerbabe 

And some would disagree.

I was encouraged when I learned that this Pope came from Italian immigrants (me, too) and chose the name Francis.

But I was disappointed.

[just bee]

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@Laura14 wrote:

@KKJ The Catholic Church (and I am an American Catholic) is a business like any other religion.

They tend to choose popes in areas where the religion is growing to help bolster the spread of Catholicism around the world and the money coming in which is why you hear about Asian and African front runners.

That's not cynicism. That's the business of my church and every other religious organization. Without a viable, growing charitable membership, the Church can't stay in the customs to which they like to belong to.

America has been declining in membership not to mention the decades of abuse scandal so it's not really in anyone's interest in Vatican City to nominate an American cardinal for the top job.  

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@Laura14 Not quite accurate. Europe has faced the most decline not only in membership but in the number of priests.

Outside of Europe Catholicism is still growing globally including in North and South America. The highest increase is in the African nations.

The abuse scandal certainly contributes to a percentage of decline but so did Vatican Ii with conservative Catholics disliking the changes.

AI is not my go to source for accuracy either. This is not directed at you. Just an observation that it's being used more and more as a reputable source. 

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There's an old expression in the world of theatre: Butts in seats.

A theatre needs butts in seats to survive.

Similarly, a church requires butts in pews.

Numbers.  That's what any organization is focused on.

[bikerbabe]

What you teach is more important than numbers, especially in church. I realize church is a business. That’s the problem, isn’t it, when the thought toward money drives the message.

Numbers aren’t always the right path.

[bikerbabe]

The church still has a lot that needs to change.

I suspect I would say that about many churches, unfortunately.

But that is a different topic….

[just bee]

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@bikerbabe wrote:
What you teach is more important than numbers, especially in church. I realize church is a business. That’s the problem, isn’t it, when the thought toward money drives the message.

Numbers aren’t always the right path.

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@bikerbabe 

Yes, the message is important.  And it must be clear and consistent.

And perhaps a consistent message will attract more believers.

In the world we live in, numbers are important.  In fact, they're crucial.

[stevieb]

It would be very interesting to be able to discuss election to the papacy in detail, including whether or not a more liberal church ceases to be Catholic and becomes something altogether different, along with Benedict's perspective on relativism, but unfortunately, the traffic here won't bear it. To avoid this thread being shut down, as others were, it might be wise to steer clear of anything that smacks of an 'argument' or anything that smacks too much of religiosity.

[bikerbabe]

I definitely don’t want to argue. 💕

[just bee]

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@stevieb wrote:

It would be very interesting to be able to discuss election to the papacy in detail, including whether or not a more liberal church ceases to be Catholic and becomes something altogether different, along with Benedict's perspective on relativism, but unfortunately, the traffic here won't bear it. To avoid this thread being shut down, as others were, it might be wise to steer clear of anything that smacks of an 'argument' or anything that smacks too much of religiosity.

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@stevieb 

@bikerbabe 

Agree.  I don't want to argue, either.

But it's an interesting topic whether or not one is Catholic.

I'd love to hear what others want to see in a new Pope; however, I know that will only invite divisive commentary.

This seems to be a fork in the road for the Church.  I hope, for all of us, Catholic or not, they make a wise, thoughtful decision.

[faeriemoon]

Based on some of the posts here, I think many of you might find the movie "The Two Popes" interesting.  I saw it when it first came out in 2019, but may watch it again. You can read the storyline on IMDB. 

It is a docudrama about the relationship between Pope Benedict and Pope Francis.

[Stray]

I have lived in Italy part of the year for many years now.   I am not a Catholic but my husband is a very devout one.  However, I have always been fascinated by the Papacy, the Vatican itself & the mystery of the conclave.  

I consider myself lucky & blessed to have met the three last popes at private audiences multiple times.  

The pope doesn't have the power as world leaders do but he is a moral leader & one who serves as a collective conscious ideation of goodness & purity.   No matter how powerful a leader may be or how ruthless, they all visit with the pope & seek his approval; his opinion & statements matter.  Putin's condolence letter stands out to me above the others; it was heartfelt & showed sincerity & thought.  

All three Popes had similarities in their personalities & differences & all three changed the Catholic Church in some way.   When in their presence, I felt I was with someone special.   I also believe John Paul, Benedict & Francis communicated their preferences as his successor.   I think the cardinals have a good idea who the next pope will be & the conclave a short one.