Community Chat

[pitdakota]

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@Isobel Archer wrote:

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@pitdakota wrote:

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@pitdakota  I asked about the homeless first so I'll explain why.  Yes I know we aren't testing to your satisfaction.  However, if this virus spreads - and kills - exponentially as you have insisted - and since it has hit nursing homes hard, I just asked why we haven't seen more deaths among the homeless - in shelters, in the street encampments - where they are in close proximity and should be very susceptible.

Clearly many are living in squalor - we've already heard about TB, Tyfus and other diseases.  Wouldn't this virus be worse?

Are you suggesting that they are, in fact, dying in droves, but no one has noticed or cared?  

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@Isobel Archer,  I do maintain that left unmitigated this virus has the significant possibility to infect large numbers of people and cause a considerable disease burden on the population & overwhelm the health care system by the number of cases requiring hospitalization in a particular area all at the same time.  Why?  Because that is what novel viruses love to do.  A novel virus left unchecked with no natural immunity among the population, no vaccine, and no known anti-virals currently known to mitigate replication, these types of viruses love to go wild and mutate very quickly.  There is nothing to stop the mutation with no natural immunity, vaccine, or treatment.  And with mutation, it is always a possibility to get a stronger virus that produces in infection and increases mortality in other age groups not impacted as signficantly as before the mutation occurred.   There are clinical articles out there now maintaing that the virus has already mutated.  

But as to the homeless, no I am not saying they are dying in droves.  What I am saying is that given our situation today, we have no clue what the incidence is in the homeless population as it truly exists on the ground.  And just because it isn't sweeping through any population currently, doesn't mean it isn't there and won't become a major problem in a couple of weeks.  The incubation period for this particular virus appears to be around 2 weeks.  Just because it hasn't happened yet, doesn't mean that it is not perculating.  We just don't know yet. Which is why I asked, how do you know it hasn't impacted the homeless community.  We just can't say that as of now.   They are certainly at high risk if they are staying in a shelter.  

And if the information I saw earlier is correct, that may change since I think as of yesterday (I think) there was a homeless individual in New York that did test positive. It certainly bears watching and hopefully won't lead to a cluster of other cases.   I also read that Boston is setting up a testing center along with tents for isolation for those testing positive across from a homeless shelter.  So kudos to them for trying to stay ahead of this potential problem.  

[Drythe]

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@pitdakota wrote:

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@Isobel Archer wrote:

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@pitdakota wrote:

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@pitdakota  I asked about the homeless first so I'll explain why.  Yes I know we aren't testing to your satisfaction.  However, if this virus spreads - and kills - exponentially as you have insisted - and since it has hit nursing homes hard, I just asked why we haven't seen more deaths among the homeless - in shelters, in the street encampments - where they are in close proximity and should be very susceptible.

Clearly many are living in squalor - we've already heard about TB, Tyfus and other diseases.  Wouldn't this virus be worse?

Are you suggesting that they are, in fact, dying in droves, but no one has noticed or cared?  

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_________________________________________________________

@Isobel Archer,  I do maintain that left unmitigated this virus has the significant possibility to infect large numbers of people and cause a considerable disease burden on the population & overwhelm the health care system by the number of cases requiring hospitalization in a particular area all at the same time.  Why?  Because that is what novel viruses love to do.  A novel virus left unchecked with no natural immunity among the population, no vaccine, and no known anti-virals currently known to mitigate replication, these types of viruses love to go wild and mutate very quickly.  There is nothing to stop the mutation with no natural immunity, vaccine, or treatment.  And with mutation, it is always a possibility to get a stronger virus that produces in infection and increases mortality in other age groups not impacted as signficantly as before the mutation occurred.   There are clinical articles out there now maintaing that the virus has already mutated.  

But as to the homeless, no I am not saying they are dying in droves.  What I am saying is that given our situation today, we have no clue what the incidence is in the homeless population as it truly exists on the ground.  And just because it isn't sweeping through any population currently, doesn't mean it isn't there and won't become a major problem in a couple of weeks.  The incubation period for this particular virus appears to be around 2 weeks.  Just because it hasn't happened yet, doesn't mean that it is not perculating.  We just don't know yet. Which is why I asked, how do you know it hasn't impacted the homeless community.  We just can't say that as of now.   They are certainly at high risk if they are staying in a shelter.  

And if the information I saw earlier is correct, that may change since I think as of yesterday (I think) there was a homeless individual in New York that did test positive. It certainly bears watching and hopefully won't lead to a cluster of other cases.   I also read that Boston is setting up a testing center along with tents for isolation for those testing positive across from a homeless shelter.  So kudos to them for trying to stay ahead of this potential problem. 

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 @pitdakota 

So well said, thank you for fighting the good fight.

On one hand there is the cry of the media is creating general panic / hysteria, and on the other criticism for waiting for testing to find specifics. 

The  known cases seem to be doubling about  every 2+ days, and, as you said,  we’re looking backward, of course once the symptoms show.

Two local medical centers have asked if people have extra PPD & masks to please let them know.  

Please have care care for yourself.

*** Edited to add the Secretary of Defence has announced that the 

Hospital Ship Comfort will be dispatched to help with hard hit areas such as NYC.  She will not take COVD19 patients, due to lack of isolation capability, but will handle care for other types of patients.

This seems to confirm the need for more hospital beds.  Hope so!

[Isobel Archer]

The cases are  rising because we are doing more testing.  The deaths are rising too, but actually very slowly.  We are currently at 106 - which again when compared with 3,000 to 7,000 per month who die of flu is hardly comparable.

I saw Dr. Fauci tonight saying that "cases will rise exponentially" and we "may see that reduces the death rate" - um yeah I think we will see that.  At least he didn't repeat his "millions will die" mantra tonight.  I wonder if now all the focus is going to be on "all the new cases" - which again unless they are putting large numbers of  people in the hospital is still not cause for the current panic.

[suzyQ3]

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@Isobel Archer wrote:

Again - 93 people have died - and if it was due to lack of ventilators/doctors/etc., it's certainly news to me.

22,000 to 50,000 died of flu  (over 3,000 to 7,00 per MONTH according to CDC) - not sure how many due to respiratory issues.  No panic there - hey business as usual.

We are two months in  - 93 people.  We only started massive quarantining last week.  We should have already seen the "exponential" spike before we quarantined.  I know they claim we still will.  We'll certainly see.

But creating this hysteria is just wrong.

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Oh, how things have changed from way back when there were only 93 deaths. It was this post that made me look at the date of thread.

@Isobel Archer 

[CrazyDaisy]

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@Pecky wrote:

Posts like this is what is causing people to panic and have anxiety.  

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And when these statements turn out to be totally unsubstantiated statements, the rest just stop listening.  

[deepwaterdotter]

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@CrazyDaisy wrote:

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@Pecky wrote:

Posts like this is what is causing people to panic and have anxiety.  

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And when these statements turn out to be totally unsubstantiated statements, the rest just stop listening.  

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What can be done to keep "the rest" listening?

[suzyQ3]

@deepwaterdotter @CrazyDaisy, take noteof my post here today. This thread is from the beginning of the crisis.

[Yahooey]

OLD THREAD FROM MARCH 2020

[Porcelain]

I do see that some have been consistent in their denial and name calling from the beginning. The blase dismissal of the death toll as it mounted is chilling. No lessons have been learned.

[ollie5]

Are the Zombies here yet?