Community Chat

[Pook]

@Cakers3  You obviously just want to argue but reread what I posted.  I underlined what you did not grasp from my post.  Nowhere did I say the gov is lying or fudging - just taking the easy way out rather than posting the stats for each grouping on teh SNAP benefit chart and not using averages which never paint a true picture!!!

[Trinity11]

---

@SahmIam wrote:

@Cakers3  Unfortunately, the issues @IamMrsG  wrote about DO occur. To turn a blind eye to those truths as well as condemn anyone who points it out is foolish and doesn't help the situation in any way.

Outreach groups must think about these things; that's why they have rules. They often seem fair and cruel but there are always two sides. That's simply reality. 

A Pastor friend of mine who works in the WORST sections of Baltimore City would agree (much to the chagrin of many here) regarding constantly giving and giving. At city meetings, at his Church, during outreach he is always saying:

"Give a man a fish, he eats for the moment. Teach a man to fish, he eats forever".

There MOST be more done than just giving it away. There ARE those who cheat and make it their mission to do so and teach OTHERS to do the same. NONE of this is fair to those who need. NONE of it. But it happens and constantly. And it always destroys it for those it is truly intended for. THAT is what people should be angry at; not at posters putting forth a opinion you don't agree with (for whatever the reason).

---

All great in theory but who suffers the most when what you call "giving it away" stops. The CHILDREN, THAT'S WHO. That is completely UNACCEPTABLE TO ME. AND YES I AM SHOUTING.

[Cakers3]

---

@Pook wrote:

@Cakers3  You obviously just want to argue but reread what I posted.  I underlined what you did not grasp from my post.  Nowhere did I say the gov is lying or fudging - just taking the easy way out rather than posting the stats for each grouping on teh SNAP benefit chart and not using averages which never paint a true picture!!!

---

@Pook  Arguing goes both ways. 

Let me understand:  I'm arguing because I don't agree with everything you say.

You, however, are the fount of all knowledge about the topic.

I know you didn't use those words-but you said that the govt stats are not accurate.

Therefore, one can conclude that the govt is lying and fudging.  A logical conclusion.

I am debating a topic; to accuse of arguing with you because I present facts you do not like- you are doing the same thing.

I've given agreement on some issues; and debated the opposite on others.

You, however, are stuck on monotone. 

I've agreed that helping people provide better meals is a good thing.
I agree there are scammers; I don't agree that the numbers are high.

I disagree that scammers cause other people to starve.

And so it goes. 

[Cakers3]

---

@dex wrote:

@Cakers3 @I didn’t say all get both but that snap isn’t all of the help available.

---

@dex   I know SNAP isnt' the only help.  I misread your opening sentence.

Mea culpa.

[SahmIam]

@Trinity11  You can shout all you want; it doesn't change the reality.

Children will ALWAYS suffer when the system doesn't work. Thieves, scammers, the dishonest...they don't care about the children. They don't care about anyone but themselves. When community centers are shut down, when soup kitchens are shut down, when clinics are shut down BECAUSE OF the liars, the cheaters, the scammers, the children (and the elderly I might add) pay the price.

All I am saying is that to only give and do nothing more is not working. It isn't. It isn't in my county, it isn't in Baltimore City, it isn't in my state. That doesn't mean you STOP, however, and I don't see where anyone said that. What it DOES mean is you step back and see if there is a more effective way to address the problem. The sad fact is often there is but it's EASIER the old way and so....it continues.

Those of us who have worked in the public sector and have spent decades doing it HAVE seen and have had to DEAL with the exact issues @IamMrsG experienced. And yes, there are stats; they are usually not made public but ARE used by agencies to adjust, change and close their programs. I know; I was involved in the process quite often.

[masque]

---

@cherry wrote:

I am not sure exactly what heaven will be like, but I don’t know that when we die and it comes time for God to judge us, he will NOT ask, ‘How many good things have you done in your life?’ Rather he will ask, ‘How much LOVE did you put into what you did?’” – Mother Teresa

---

Ephesians 2:9

“Not of works, lest any man should boast.”

King James Version (KJV)

[dex]

@Cakers3 @Thanks...we don’t need to agree entirely on stuff but I do think you are a kind and thoughtful person and I admire your determination to help.

[Cakers3]

We have always had, and will always have, the poor, the addicted, the homeless, the hungry, the abused.  The world is not meant to be perfect, no matter what anybody says and how they plan to make it so.

What I am having a problem with is the ones who tout their experience; as though the rest of us have no clue.  That is unfair and does not take into account that some of us have worked in those very systems.

If one has a better solution, after observing and seeing the problem that I guess the rest of us do not, then perhaps it's time to get your act into gear.

And again, the rate of scamming is so low and I've yet to see anyone present any back up that people starve because of scammers. 

Food banks shut down, certainly.

Neighborhood clinics shut down, certainly.

I just watched a program about a clinic in New Mexico where everyone could get treated, regardless of insurance.  The struggle to maintain the clinic.

But at least they did something-they didn't sit back and tsk tsk and blame somebody who gets Medicaid and doesn't deserve it.

Some just keep focusing on what is wrong instead of submitting not only what is right but what can be done to improve the welfare of all people.

[Trinity11]

---

@SahmIam wrote:

@Trinity11  You can shout all you want; it doesn't change the reality.

Children will ALWAYS suffer when the system doesn't work. Thieves, scammers, the dishonest...they don't care about the children. They don't care about anyone but themselves. When community centers are shut down, when soup kitchens are shut down, when clinics are shut down BECAUSE OF the liars, the cheaters, the scammers, the children (and the elderly I might add) pay the price.

All I am saying is that to only give and do nothing more is not working. It isn't. It isn't in my county, it isn't in Baltimore City, it isn't in my state. That doesn't mean you STOP, however, and I don't see where anyone said that. What it DOES mean is you step back and see if there is a more effective way to address the problem. The sad fact is often there is but it's EASIER the old way and so....it continues.

Those of us who have worked in the public sector and have spent decades doing it HAVE seen and have had to DEAL with the exact issues @IamMrsG experienced. And yes, there are stats; they are usually not made public but ARE used by agencies to adjust, change and close their programs. I know; I was involved in the process quite often.

---

You see your reality is very different from mine @SahmIam . You choose to emphasize and dwell on what you call "scammers" 'thieves" and "liars" but I saw the faces of poverty and the total lack of funding where people had to choose between feeding themselves and affording a vial of insulin for their child. 

Many like to reference the scammers but truth be told it has far more to do with government shut-downs of services desperately needed than it ever has been about scammers. And that is my REALITY....

[cherry]

People who think it is OK ,just to destroy a family, by tearing it apart ,without one thought ,for the lives they are destroying in the process ,scares me to death