Community Chat

[151949]

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@AngusandBuddhasMom wrote:

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@occasionalrain wrote:

Too much. I've lost patience with the soft meltdown term, call it what it is, an out of control attack. Teachers shouldn't need shin guards and hockey masks in the classroom. No child should be expected to witness a classmate attacking his teacher. That students need an escape plan to avoid injury from a classmate is just wrong.

All this concern for the restrained child while none for his classmates and teacher is misplaced. 

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Your correct it is the child's fault not the "adults" dealing with said child. Instead of blaming a child how about the adults who are in charge and clearly lack and ability to deal with this situation or apparently any situation without brute force? This is not the 1950's where these poor kids would be most likely shackled and forgotten. 

I just said our school system deals with this issue and it works without humiliating or hurting the child who is clearly in need of help. But that takes initiative and intelligence not laziness and brute force.

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@AngusandBuddhasMom wrote:

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@occasionalrain wrote:

Too much. I've lost patience with the soft meltdown term, call it what it is, an out of control attack. Teachers shouldn't need shin guards and hockey masks in the classroom. No child should be expected to witness a classmate attacking his teacher. That students need an escape plan to avoid injury from a classmate is just wrong.

All this concern for the restrained child while none for his classmates and teacher is misplaced. 

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Your correct it is the child's fault not the "adults" dealing with said child. Instead of blaming a child how about the adults who are in charge and clearly lack and ability to deal with this situation or apparently any situation without brute force? This is not the 1950's where these poor kids would be most likely shackled and forgotten. 

I just said our school system deals with this issue and it works without humiliating or hurting the child who is clearly in need of help. But that takes initiative and intelligence not laziness and brute force.

So what exactly do they do in a situation like this. Right now, in the moment ,as it is happening? I really want to know.

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[surfk]

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@CrazyDaisy wrote:

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@surfk wrote:

I don't think that anyone is "judging" anyone here. I think, though, that people are looking for better solutions to threatening or violent special needs children in the schoolroom other than calling in the SWAT team or handcuffing or tying them to a chair.

I mean, there has to be a BETTER solution than that.

Otherwise, there was not much point in society moving out of a Dickensian era of madhouse snake pits, beatings, restraint tables and ball-in-mouth gags.

No matter how popular those things may remain in other circles, they don't belong in modern education in the 21st century.

If one wishes to react to such students with thrashings or ropes, you were sadly born in the wrong century.

What next? We cut off the pretty girl's hair because it defies godliness by falling into natural curls of the devil's vanity??

As educators and parents (as a society) we should be striving to do better and not just falling into what is immediate or "easy". Because you know what's even easier than tying a kid to a chair in a school room? Don't even bother sending him to school.

Don't even bother to educate such children. That would be the easiest thing.

If one is looking for easy answers and ways to avoid problems in the school house.

We could all return to a time when special needs children were hidden away, kept rather like animals and just "endured" until they died.

But I presume we want MORE than all of that. And more than the dark atrocities committed unto such children in previous centuries.

It may not be EASY to deal with such kids. And it might be hard work to find the proper solution. But one must always look for something better.

And handcuffing children and calling out the brawny Marines to deal with 'em really isn't much of a solution. Gee why not involve Mr. Brocklehurst in their education while you're at it. Maybe he can come into the picture and send them out into the rain until they develop a sense of self-control...and double pneumonia.

If I had a child in such a situation I would already be dying a bit inside at the struggle they are enduring in life let alone the sadness I would feel to learn he or she were being restrained or tethered like a dog to a school room chair.

If I wanted that for my child, I'd have sent him to the asylum on the hill where no one bothers to know what becomes of such children.

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Your post make me chuckle....Not sure if you are serious about some of these statements or trying to be funny.  Either way very entertaining, thanks.

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Typically, references to things Dickensian are not comical or made for laughs.

[surfk]

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@occasionalrain wrote:

Too much. I've lost patience with the soft meltdown term, call it what it is, an out of control attack. Teachers shouldn't need shin guards and hockey masks in the classroom. No child should be expected to witness a classmate attacking his teacher. That students need an escape plan to avoid injury from a classmate is just wrong.

All this concern for the restrained child while none for his classmates and teacher is misplaced. 

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The solution to such students though is not to then tie them up, muzzle them and/or chain them to a desk.

Something other must be done with a student so prone to physical violence. Some environments - including a classroom one - are not the right place or fit for all students (some teachers, too).

The trick would be to PREVENT the violent situation from happening in the first place. The solution is rooted in that and not in punitive actions afterwards.

[NC Bandwagon]

....Quite the heavy subject that this thread is.

I have no answers. None. All I can say is I feel bad for everyone in this situation.

I feel bad for the officers because they did the best that they could. Can't fault someone for not knowing what to do.

I feel bad for the child who probably doesn't even know why he's doing what he's doing. This isn't how he wants to be.

I feel bad for the teachers who have to deal with this and then come back to class like everything is fine.

I feel bad for the parents who are doing their best to raise these children. The stress they have to deal with must be off the charts.

I feel bad for the people in this thread who've been on the receiving end of these kinds of attacks. Remember, people who don't have disabilities are human and have feelings, too. We mustn't shove their feelings to the side.

I feel bad for all involved in this situation. There's no easy answers and really, there's no one to blame. Just people trying to do their best with what they know how.

[NC Bandwagon]

Let's try to be kind to each other about this, ladies.

Everyone here has had their own life experiences and I highly doubt anyone here is a bad parent/teacher/caregiver. This was a bad situation where there wasn't much time to react. Even if people know what to do, people may simply not have enough time to react.

Again, there's no easy answers. It's easy to say what we would do. Not so easy when put in that situations. My heart goes out to those who either have to deal with this on a regular basis and/or have to deal with situations where they don't know what to do, but are expected them to know what to do.

[LTT1]

The news report SHOWED THE CHILD AND THE OFFICER!  It was horrible for that poor child! As a former SPED teacher, it was of ultimate importance not to touch students. No no no! And Ono

Certain teachers in our building were taught in a course [certification and yearly certification] the only acceptable way to perform a proper "take down (to the floor).  The usual implication was that this procedure was to be used (usually) to stop two fighting students.

In my years, there were two such incidents: the first involved administration (two slight but authoritative women) separating two students. There was some blood...my job was to calmly get the others into the hall.

I think there will be many consequences in the incident shown on TV last night.

[colliegirls]

I cannot imagine handcuffing a child, but I have been in many classrooms where an autistic(usually) child was having a difficult day and throwing chairs, knocking down desks, hitting, cursing, and spitting. These were elementary school age children. Everyone in the room was in danger of being hurt  Some children should not be mainstreamed in the classroom, but at times parents insist.

 Usually we had to take the other students out of the classroom to another room while teachers tried to get the child to calm down, and then their mother was called. It is very upsetting to all involved.

[NoelSeven]

It surprises me that anyone supports brutalizing a small disabled child.

One argument for doing so is based on the mistaken idea that they have to learn.  Their disability is such that 1) They don't have control over what happens with them internally, and 2) It's a medical condition, they are not going to learn anything by being brutalized.

Thankfully, the majority of people do not go along with this, one of our posters even quoted a poll where the response was overwhelmingly NO.

Even IF the issue was about violent kids instead of disabled children. teaching by the use of adult violence does not do anything other than... teach more violence. 

[riley1]

We did not mainstream our son. He was in a basic skills resource room. He had lunch and maybe a few things outside of this room but not much. He didn't belong in a regular classroom as he couldn't learn the way other kids did. Most tests had to be done orally instead of written. He had both good and bad days. On very bad days they called me and I picked him up. That was our life and we were a team. We faced reality early on with no visions of grandeur. His neurologist was brutally honest - for which I am grateful. When you have a kid with disabilities, you have to be prepared for the next step before it creeps up and smacks you in the face. We had IEP meetings and discussed everything before it was done.