Re: Charlie rose?

Isobel Archer · ‎04-04-2015

@Sooner wrote:
@NycVixen wrote:
My DH has a family member who works in media.

This person had to send out about 300 resumes to end up getting a crummy job at one of the networks. Has a Master's degree.

Media jobs and good ones are very scarce. I wouldn't be asking why the women he did this to stayed at the job.

I would ask why did they have to be subjected to this alleged abuse?

When someone like Charlie Rose with his power can make or break your nascent career with just one phone call, email, conversation or letter, it's clear that any woman that felt she had no choice but to cope and try to persist is not to blame here.

Wrong question to ask IMO. Demonstrates how powerful society makes a certain number of people namely men at the expense of so many others.

PEOPLE PUT UP WITH IT. Sorry but as long as people put up with something, it goes on. Doing the right thing is often painful. So are you going to trade a job for this behavior? It's a decision you have to make. AND as long as there are those out there who say oh it's just part of the business it will go on. SO what do you do about that? Apparently people won't even report it.

It's about morality and what you are willing to sacrifice for it. I'm not saying it's right, but it's reality. Right and reality are two different things. In Hollywood, there are a lot of standards that won't fly with some people. Somewhere society as a whole has to decide what it will allow and what it will accept. As a society we accept, enable, or refuse to accept behavior. And to stop something, a lot of people have to make difficult decisions and be willing to say no. . . Apparently Mr. Rose stopped when some of these woman said NO, or by behavior refused to comply. But as long as some will put up with it, you won't stop it. SO what happens then?

I am asking questions here, and I would love comments and discussion. But "it's wrong" is not an answer or a solution. What action should be taken? How do we change attitudes? Who is going to speak up to stop it? Etc. etc. Does "shame" enter the picture? A few years ago someone in an important position got away with it but is still beloved and respected. So will that be the case with many of these guys? Just tossing out the question.

A problem won't go away because "it is wrong." A problem has to be dealt with, and how do we do that? THAT's my point here.

And just what happened to women who DID complain about powerful men in the past?

Bimbo eruptions? Who believed them? Remember Nuts and Sluts, drag a $5 bill through a trailer park and see what allegations you get?

Isobel Archer · ‎04-04-2015

@Noel7 wrote:
I wonder why we see women who can’t believe this kind of sexual harassment happens at all.

Then there are others who insinuate it was the fault of the victim.

Yes - even in the case of a 12 year old virgin who was brutally raped and beaten (into a coma) - and even all these years later there is no concern or remorse for her ruined life - because trashing her was just "part of the job of defending her rapist."

SaRina · ‎04-17-2015

I'm not going to tell my story yet again because we can start one of these threads every day it seems and have the same discussion.

In the 1980's, several women at work, including myself, reported our abuser. He was fired. I was fired shortly thereafter. I'm not sorry I spoke up. It was my responsibility and my obligation... and I did it for my own self-respect.

There is enough blame to go around. As a poster here so eloquently and succinctly stated in one of the previous threads...... (paraphrasing) Silence is the abuser's greatest ally. And that's the truth. If people remain silent about such abuse, they are perpetuating this sick culture. If parents (particularly fathers, who wink and nod to their sons) don't teach their children how to respect others, that is a big part of the problem.

I find it incredibly sad that this is being addressed only now, in 2017. I would have though this problem would have been addressed many years ago.

There is enough blame to go around.

Oznell · ‎11-08-2014

Yes, @Isobel Archer, I remember in the Nineties in particular when women were speaking up with credible accounts of assaults and also abuse of subordinates (apart from, and distiinguished, from consensual affairs). There was a systematic operation by both men and a woman of authority who labeled them "bimbo eruptions" and with the sometimes complicit help of the press, proceeded to systematically smear them. I could not believe it at the time.

Isobel Archer · ‎04-04-2015

I agree the issue is complicated - although not as complicated as some people make it.

I find it more than appalling that many are willing to believe all allegations against those those they don't like - but then call allegations against those they otherwise admire - untrue (Lena Dunham is an example of defending her friend, but believing allegations against others.)

I also think that it is easy to make up allegations against those you don't like or want to see hurt - so I'm not in the camp of believing every allegation - even against those I don't like. There does need to be some level of substantiation - and forging yearbook signatures doesn't help with that. NOT saying that makes the other women liars, but it does confuse the issue - as do allegations that reporters are paying for women to come forward. NOT saying that's true either - but the allegations are out there.

At the same time, I think it is unconscionable to simply trash women who make the allegations - again with no proof that they are lying (and in that regard, I just find it beyond the pale what was said about the 12 year old rape and beating victim I mentioned earlier. It is one thing to say your client didn't do it (even tho you knew he did), but quite another to smear the victim as causing the problem).

So, I think we all need to take a deep breath and see where the facts lie. In the situations where these allegations are many years old, it may be difficult to tell what actually happened.

I definitely think this is an issue whose time has come and I am glad to see those who were/are abusers face their accusers - and the justified anger of us all.