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Honored Contributor
Posts: 16,008
Registered: ‎06-09-2014

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

@bathina  That's a false equivalency.  We are bigger country than most and guns are legal here which they are not in most. 

 

Apples and oranges.  You have to have level playing fields or characteristics to start that debate.  

Honored Contributor
Posts: 14,917
Registered: ‎03-09-2010

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

I think that right now in this country people have too much attitude and it sure isn’t a good attitude.

Respected Contributor
Posts: 2,916
Registered: ‎03-14-2010

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

[ Edited ]

@Laura14 wrote:

@bathina  That's a false equivalency.  We are bigger country than most and guns are legal here which they are not in most. 

 

Apples and oranges.  You have to have level playing fields or characteristics to start that debate.  



You are incorrect. Gun deaths are reported as a percentage of population. The U.S has the highest percentages in the civilized world. Simple Google inquiries will prove this out.

 

What you are correct about is the easy access to guns in the US as opposed to other countries. Which is the root cause of our gun violence problem.

Honored Contributor
Posts: 16,008
Registered: ‎06-09-2014

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

@bathina  That doesn't address the main issue which is that guns are easily accessible here. Not so much in other countries.  Impossible to do a fair comparison when each side isn't coming from the same access or place. 

 

I know Michael Moore made his career on a false premise like this, but it doesn't do it for me.  I like fairness and integrity in my comparisons instead.

 

 

Respected Contributor
Posts: 2,916
Registered: ‎03-14-2010

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar


@esmerelda wrote:

@bathina wrote:

@Laura14 wrote:

@esmerelda  Social media has informed and ruined many things for me.  Smiley Happy

 

Interesting thoughts.  I think it is mental illness combined with a lack of manners and the loss of pure human decency and courtesy towards one another.  I find it beyond shocking what some people will say to another human being just because they are behind a keyboard.  And I mainly interact with supposed adults.

 

Most of these shooting instances are kids killing kids.  I think they all need to get off their phones and look in the mirror and stop bullying their peers into complete mental breakdowns through texts, snapchat, FB, IG, etc... 

 

Pipe dream I know but I think there is a lot to be said for being forced to be nasty in person to someone's actual face.  You'll see a lot less of it and this.    

 

  


Does mental illness, lack of manners, loss of decency and courtesy exist only in this country? Because mass shootings don't happen anywhere else at the frequency they happen here. 


@bathina Don’t we have this exchange on just about every thread with a topic like this? True, there may not be mass shootings in other countries like here. They find other ways to do this without guns. It’s as true today as it was the last time I said it to you.


Yes. We've had this conversation before. The reason being as have an endless string of gun carnage in this country.  Have never heard of the level of killing by knife or car or anything else in other countries. When was the last time England or Canada or France had 26 deaths in a 2 week period by knife or car? 

Valued Contributor
Posts: 670
Registered: ‎03-14-2010

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

Just out of curiosity, what exactly is "the civilized world" @bathina?

And which countries are uncivilized?

Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 7,097
Registered: ‎09-05-2014

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

Deaths by firearms are generally reported per 100,000 population.

 

The United States absolutely does not have the highest statiscally by this measurement, internationally, although it is higher than most European nations.

 

 How one defines "civilized" is, of course, subjective.

Respected Contributor
Posts: 2,916
Registered: ‎03-14-2010

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar


@Laura14 wrote:

@bathina  That doesn't address the main issue which is that guns are easily accessible here. Not so much in other countries.  Impossible to do a fair comparison when each side isn't coming from the same access or place. 

 

I know Michael Moore made his career on a false premise like this, but it doesn't do it for me.  I like fairness and integrity in my comparisons instead.

 

 


You know you are proving my argument,  right? My argument is that guns are easily accessible, which is why we have more gun violence. Glad we agree on the "main issue". 

Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 7,339
Registered: ‎03-11-2010

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

[ Edited ]
Spoiler
 

Well I just woke up am an shocked. I have been to Boarderline many times. My parents have danced there for 20 plus years. They used to take my nephew there on Sunday afternoons where they had family day with a deal on line dancing and buffet. 

Wrong is still wrong just because you benefited from it.
Honored Contributor
Posts: 17,511
Registered: ‎06-17-2015

Re: CA Shooting, 12 Dead on 'Student Night' at Bar

[ Edited ]

We pray for the souls of the departed and we pray for comfort for the survivors.

However, prayer does not have to have a religious tone.

 

Thoughts are not fleeting; who is to say that when a person offers "thought" that he/she does not continue to think about the tragedy long after it is over in the news and does not continue to think about solutions.

 

I find it sad when people denigrate those who post "thoughts and prayers".  People can feel so helpless at such times; people are not in control of the tragedy nor are they in control of solutions.

 

The cry to VOTE is admirable but has yet to change one thing about gun violence.

 

We look at one incident and ignore turf wars between gangs and the following gun deaths that result form those wars.

 

We shout to the hilltops about semi-automatic weapons but fail to see that handguns are used, too; in this case a Glock.

 

We point to mental illness and we point to expanding background checks; and yet the elephant in the room is that these weapons have already been purchased; some legally, some illegally, but nevertheless purchased.

 

Would a mass round up of weapons tomorrow stop the hate that has fueld these tragedies?  No.  We will never be able to prove that had this person not had a handgun that these young people would be alive.

 

That is the crux of the matter.

 

The fact that this club catered to country music is another point; the assumption that anyone enjoying country music just has to be the worst of the worst in our society.

As though only one side enjoys country music.

 

Labels.  The start of all that is unholy.

 

I'm offering thoughts and prayers and those who do not like it be darned, for all I care.

 

I pray for souls, I pray for survivors, I pray for my family, I pray for hearts and minds to be cleansed of stereotypical ideas, and I will continue to think about the vicitms as I will continue to think about not only my family but the families of everyone here and beyond.

 

And I pray for myself that I never lose sight of the fact that no matter who likes me, who disagrees with me, who doesn't like me, that I remember my siggie at all times.

 

 

"" Compassion is a verb."-Thich Nhat Hanh