Burden of Proof? - Page 3

Carmie · ‎10-25-2010

It’s really difficult to know who is guilty and who is not. I know that I have been shocked a few times in my life over sexual assault allegations against men that I have known for years and had no idea that they would ever do this...but they did.

One who is related to my SIL was sexually assaulting his own daughter since she was very young. He is married to a really nice woman that I went to school with who had no idea.

this daughter has always been a problem child and got involved with alcohol and drugs. She was in and out of the court system for years. We all wondered how lovely parents Could have produced such a child.

She finally moved abroad and had no contact with her family. While in a foreign country, she received psych help and confessed what her father was doing. Her psych helped her contacted the local police dept in the states.

She was advised to call her her father and confront him for what he did. The phone call was recorded. Dad said he was sorry and was crying, etc.

Well, he was arrested and the daughter came back to the states for the trial. Dad is doing prison time and since he is now in his 60’s he probably will die in prison.

the whole story is very sad; however, the worse of it was the sisters of the father. They came to the court house and when Dad was sentenced, they called the daughter all kinds of horrible names and blamed her for everything. The judge had to have them removed from the courtroom.

This poor girl was physically abused by her father and verbally abused by her father’s sisters. He is the only boy in a family of 11 kids.

We all know that brushing up against a woman is not assault and I haven’t seen any one that was outed for doing that. So far everything I have heard or seen has been a conscience effort to “ cop a feel” or try to force someone into doing something against their will, indecent exposure, etc.

no matter what the crime is, there will always be innocent people who are accused. There will also be always be innocent people who will be taken advantage of by those who are more powerful.

It’s a sad time we are living in now. The muck is hitting the fan. I hope and pray that all of this will change the conditions for everyone...men, women and children.

We all deserve respect.

sidsmom · ‎11-25-2011

I have a feeling when these women finally muster up the courage

to go to work authorities, HR says, ’yeah, we were expecting it.’

Rare it’s ‘just one’ woman.

There’s a pattern.

There IS proof.

A ‘Once, Twice, Three times, You’re out.’ scenario.

Unfortunately, for many, it’s been waaaaaaaaay more than 3x.

Too many men have been called out, but nothing’s been done.

Innocents?

Not to say that wouldn’t happen, but it’ll probably be a

very “cold day in July” before these accusers will fight back.

They know what they did wasn’t right.

And like another victim said recently,

‘you know men are waking up every day at 4am in a cold sweat

waiting for the other shoe to fall.’

webbgarner1 · ‎06-13-2017

I agree with what the actress Pamela Anderson had to say and I had long thought. In al ot of these situations, these women who are now calling theirself victims should have known better. Why would you go to a mans hotel room alone and him being there alone as well. You are sending the message, yeah I will play along, then cry harassment years later.

Now if someone is denying you a promotion in the workplace unless you do sexual favors that is different matter. But a lot of these women, not all, put thierself in these positions and did not set bounderies.

Most men will stop the behavior if you stand your ground and tell them it is not appreciated and do not do it again, but when you play along and then complain that is wrong.

suzyQ3 · ‎03-09-2010

What I see is a whole lot of people claiming to understand sexual harassment only through their own puffed-up ideas of what THEY would have done.

If someoned makes a false accusation, shame on them. If someone has exploited or harasssed someone, shame on them.

~Who in the world am I? Ah, that's the great puzzle~ Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

occasionalrain · ‎03-10-2010

I don't approve of the double standard where the man is named while the accuser's name is protected. This is unfair. Either both names are released or both protected.

Oznell · ‎11-08-2014

That is interesting, @occasionalrain. I didn't realize there were any of the high profile current instances where that was the case, but now that I think of it, that's true.

zitawins · ‎02-28-2017

And let us not forget that there are women predators out there, too. It's not just men who are making assaults, verbal or physical. There are also women in high positions who can make or break a man's career simply because the men disagreed with them or rebuffed advances.

I don't believe in revisionist offences. What happened forty years ago has little to do with today's laws and mores. As a culture, yes, women have been repressed, but that is no reason to be part of what is definitely a witch hunt. Women today are much too eager to point fingers and destroy lives.

aggravated · ‎03-12-2010

I thought Harold Ford (Morning Joe) former Representative, was now a professor at a University (mid-west). Are we writing about the same person? Well, I just completed a search and the financial institution was given as his employer. I was wrong. I could have sworn he had been introduced the other way most mornings. I liked him.

When I was in my 20s I left a couple of jobs because a couple of men wouldn't leave me alone. I never dreamed of turning them into our employers in the hopes they would lose their jobs.

I have a few single girlfriends, we are all in our 50s and 60s. They all say men expecting sex on dates is still as troublesome as it was when we were much younger. They are not interested in your "companionship."

151949 · ‎03-09-2010

@webbgarner1 wrote:
I agree with what the actress Pamela Anderson had to say and I had long thought. In al ot of these situations, these women who are now calling theirself victims should have known better. Why would you go to a mans hotel room alone and him being there alone as well. You are sending the message, yeah I will play along, then cry harassment years later.
Now if someone is denying you a promotion in the workplace unless you do sexual favors that is different matter. But a lot of these women, not all, put thierself in these positions and did not set bounderies.
Most men will stop the behavior if you stand your ground and tell them it is not appreciated and do not do it again, but when you play along and then complain that is wrong.

I could not agree more. When you go to a man's home , apartment, or hotel alone with him there is a message being sent that implys consent. When a man offers you drugs and you knowingly accept them - also sends a message. Not to say you don't still have a right to say no , BUT, certainly you should expect some pre sexual advances to be made and they are probably going to involve some groping.Not to even mention the women who say they went to Charlie Roses house and he would get undressed and get in the shower, then walk around naked in front of them. SO GET UP AND LEAVE for Heaven's sake. Why would you just sit there ?

LoveMyBaby · ‎03-09-2010

@151949 wrote:
@LoveMyBaby wrote:
I get what you're saying....but usually where there's smoke....

President John F. Kennedy, the vast majority of boomers and their parents still love & idolize him and the Kennedy family to this day. A notorious womanizer from the whole lot of male Kennedy's starting with the father, Joe. Long suffering wives who ALL looked the other way.

I want to believe those days are over but I hardly doubt it. This too, shall pass.
There is a huge difference between a man who has consensual sex with someone he is not married to , who is of age to give consent, and a person who sexually abuses another against their will.
Certainly Monica Lewinsky was not being abused against her will - and never said she was. In the video of her & Clinton she never stopped smiling.
I've never heard any woman claim that JFK forced her against her will either.
There is no law against having an extramarital affair but forcing a woman to put up with groping, kissing or more when she doesn't want to and says no - or drugging her then doing it after she can't resist - that is against the law.

It's the ABUSE of POWER as well as serious character and moral flaws, that is the issue with these claims. And IMHO Monica Lewinsky is a VICTIM, no different than many others intimidated, groomed, NAIVE, etc. by these powerful predatory men. The young girls now being accused of consensual sex, NOT BELIEVED.

There is a long history of this abuse of power and influence on many many young interns, throughout WH history both male and female. Back in the day there was the pages, (high school aged students) preyed upon for s*x. They too could be accused of having 'consensual' relations. Nope, not buying it.

JFK and brothers were considered demigods, and there are numerous incidents documented with all of them. Can you imagine trying to come out accusing (back in the 50's and 60's) the Kennedy's? Plenty books, articles, written of the Kennedy coverups and predatory actions.

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