Community Chat

[lovesrecess]

Even lots of initial interviews are now being conducted via Zoom. The final interview is the only one done in person. SIL just began a new job a few days ago and his first time to meet anyone in person was his first day on the job; all other interaction had been on Zoom or on the phone.

[RealtyGal2]

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@MM13 wrote:

I've been filling out job applications online recently and one that I did today asked me to fill in my birthdate. I tried to skip that part in the form as I thought this was illegal, but it wouldn't let me proceed without doing that part.

I entered it in, but I'm not too thrilled about it. When did this become something they were allowed to ask?

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They should not be allowed to ask. Many employers will ask for the date you graduated high school or college as a sneaky way to find out your age. I have been descriminated against due to my age, but I can't prove it. It is fishy when you have a great interview and you are more qualified than everyone else, then they hire a 20 year old with no experience.

[Johnnyeager]

Once again, it is not illegal to ask the question.  However, most savvy employers avoid it directly. 

 How Old Are You?

RetirementJobs.com Staff Writers

Would it be illegal if a recruiter asked, "How old are you?" If you are like the majority of age 50+ job seekers, I'll wager you answered with a confident "yes." Surprisingly, it is not illegal to ask a candidate their age.  Not a good idea perhaps, but not illegal. While it may fly in the face of what you know about the Age Discrimination in Employment Act (ADEA), the question itself is legal. What would be illegal is to use your age as a factor in any hiring or employment decisions. Seems like too fine a point? Well, like so much of antidiscrimination law, there are very lines between illegal behavior and illegal behavior that can be proven.

[tototwo]

Oh for Heavens sakes!   When I was looking for jobs back in the 60's-70's, you had to list your age and attach a recent photo to your resume before you would be considered for an interview.  

Back then, interviewers would ask if you were married, if you planned to have children (or had children), and even would ask what kind of birth control you were on.   It was all perfectly legal then.  You have nothing to complain about if an employer just wants to know your age.  Be thankful for the laws we have now.

[Cakers3]

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@RealtyGal2 wrote:

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@MM13 wrote:

I've been filling out job applications online recently and one that I did today asked me to fill in my birthdate. I tried to skip that part in the form as I thought this was illegal, but it wouldn't let me proceed without doing that part.

I entered it in, but I'm not too thrilled about it. When did this become something they were allowed to ask?

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They should not be allowed to ask. Many employers will ask for the date you graduated high school or college as a sneaky way to find out your age. I have been descriminated against due to my age, but I can't prove it. It is fishy when you have a great interview and you are more qualified than everyone else, then they hire a 20 year old with no experience.

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@RealtyGal2   No you cannot prove it and you cannot prove you are more qualified than any other candidate. You cannot possibly know who interviewed, the ages, and what is on their resume.

You simply didn't get the job and that's all there is to it regardless of your age and experience.

Sorry you lost out.

[Cakers3]

I think age discrimination MIGHT be easier to be a reason if the person is already working in the company.

In other words, being passed over for a promotion where the older worker has been there longer than the person who actually gets the promotion.

Or an older worker is being nudged to retire before the time is up.

Perhaps.

It's tricky, though.  While age COULD be the reason, it also COULD NOT be the reason for internal promotions, etc.

Applying for a job would be almost impossible to prove because all one would have is "I didn't get the job because of my age".  It simply could not be proven.

[songbird]

Its a federal law, but I'm sure it's used to discriminate.  It's very difficult to prove if you think you were discriminated.  It's just one of those things you can't really do anything about. Some companies want young, vigorous, lower paid candidate. I remember recently we were looking for a new library president.  We had 6 candidates.  They all had to  make an speech on why they were the best person for the job.  One of them, was a 60 plus woman who had decided to come back from retirement. She wasn't picked.  The person that got the job was for such a position (late 30's) and male.   We preferred the woman.  But somebody made a crack about how they wanted person that would not drop dead less then a year after being hired. So believe it or not, that is a factor.

[caroln242]

My problem isn't with providing my age, it's with having to submit to a drug test just to submit an application.  I realize it's becoming standard practice to drug test employees or prospective employees, but just to submit an application??  No way.  I went to an agency looking for just a part time job and was told I'd have to take a drug test the same day I filled out the application.  When I walked out they acted all cavalier about it, like I was being unreasonable.  Guess they thought this 65 year old lady was a druggie when I did that!  I'm old fashioned I suppose, but I was appalled.

[Cakers3]

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@Johnnyeager wrote:

There are businesses and industries that absolutely discriminate based upon age.  If you haven't faced that you are quite fortunate. 

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@Johnnyeager   No doubt but proving it is the issue.

People forget that not everyone presents in the best way during an interview, too.

One may think they passed swimmingly in the interview but the person conducting the interview may not see it that way.  There is more to an interview than just experience and a polished resume; how one presents oneself can make or break the deal.

I do not doubt people are turned down for jobs for many reasons; but the proof is very difficult to obtain.

[gardenman]

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@On It wrote:

@MM13  I read an article not long ago that a human is not seeing the initial applications at larger companies. Artificial intelligence is screening applicants. It is looking for catch phrases and buzz words before it sends your application forward. You might want to invest some time in a google search to see if you can locate these. (I remember an example like "generated $250,000 in revenue"; "grew profits by 5%", etc.)  Perhaps you can find some that suit the position you are seeking.

I will leave my rant about artificial intelligence for another day and another post.

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One of the ways around the bots is to add phrases as you mention, but chose a white font when typing the information. The bot will read the information regardless of the font color and if the resume gets printed out for an interview it won't be visible, so the interviewer won't catch the lies. 

Five years ago I interviewed with a solar energy company and they had an online computer competency test you had to take. I aced it and got an interview. At the interview, the two young guys in their twenties who interviewed me asked me several times if anyone had helped me take the test. They kept insisting that older workers seemed to have a hard time with their software. I pointed out that I had 35 years of experience working with computers. I asked if they'd hire Bill Gates or Steve Jobs and they both insisted yes. I then pointed out that both Jobs and Gates were older than me. They then switched to they didn't think I would be a good fit in the culture they were trying to establish. Yeah. I didn't get the job. 

Companies hire who they want to hire. They can find out anything and everything about a potential employee if they choose to do so. Older workers aren't valued. Disabled or handicapped workers aren't valued. If they hire the "wrong person" they can find a reason to fire you. They can change the job metrics into something unreachable and when you fail to do the impossible, well, you didn't perform to the level they expected. It's all a game.