Community Chat

[gertrudecloset]

I'm not referring to intentional murder.  He is responsible for the child's death in any event @chickenbutt .  If he had taken the child out of the car, perhaps the child would be alive.  He is responsible for the child's death.

Thus: "my" murder/suicide comment.  The man killed his son.  Like many other parents out there who leave their children via neglect.  They are responsible for the children's deaths.  No one else but the parents.

[chickenbutt]

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@gertrudecloset wrote:

I'm not referring to intentional murder.  He is responsible for the child's death in any event @chickenbutt .  If he had taken the child out of the car, perhaps the child would be alive.  He is responsible for the child's death.

Thus: "my" murder/suicide comment.  The man killed his son.  Like many other parents out there who leave their children via neglect.  They are responsible for the children's deaths.  No one else but the parents.

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I understand.     Yeah, I guess 'murder' could definitely apply but, as you understand, I was thinking about the notion of 'intentional murder' that was brought up.

[gertrudecloset]

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@chickenbutt wrote:

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@gertrudecloset wrote:

I'm not referring to intentional murder.  He is responsible for the child's death in any event @chickenbutt .  If he had taken the child out of the car, perhaps the child would be alive.  He is responsible for the child's death.

Thus: "my" murder/suicide comment.  The man killed his son.  Like many other parents out there who leave their children via neglect.  They are responsible for the children's deaths.  No one else but the parents.

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I understand.     Yeah, I guess 'murder' could definitely apply but, as you understand, I was thinking about the notion of 'intentional murder' that was brought up.

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That can't be ruled out either @chickenbutt though that may not have been the case.  We don't know.  Whatever the circumstance, the man is responsibile for the child's death.  

[Sushismom]

Actually, the  involuntary killing of a human being is called manslaughter. Murder, on the other hand, indicates premeditation. 

[elated]

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@elated wrote:

I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal. What is wrong with people. If you want to take your life, don't take some innocent person with you. Where is common sense or humanity!!!

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@elated  Some others have already posted about the suicide remark-that it is unknown when he made the remark.  It could have been AFTER he discovered his son and I agree with that point.

The fact that he brought his son into the house indicates love and despair, not a deliberate act of murder and suicide.

We don't know the full timeline so I'm not going to judge the mom.

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If you read the third paragraph @gertrudecloset , the suicidal statement was made to the mother and family before the incident. 

[elated]

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@gardenman wrote:

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@elated wrote:

I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal. What is wrong with people. If you want to take your life, don't take some innocent person with you. Where is common sense or humanity!!!

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We don't know when the suicidal statements were made. they could have been made after the father found the child dead. He could have been so overcome with grief from losing the child and felt such guilt that he killed himself.

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If you read the third paragraph @gertrudecloset , the mother and family indicated that he had been making suicidal statements. I feel sorry for the baby that was left to die in the car. We have lost common sense.

[Cakers3]

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@elated wrote:

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@elated wrote:

I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal. What is wrong with people. If you want to take your life, don't take some innocent person with you. Where is common sense or humanity!!!

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@elated  Some others have already posted about the suicide remark-that it is unknown when he made the remark.  It could have been AFTER he discovered his son and I agree with that point.

The fact that he brought his son into the house indicates love and despair, not a deliberate act of murder and suicide.

We don't know the full timeline so I'm not going to judge the mom.

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If you read the third paragraph @gertrudecloset , the suicidal statement was made to the mother and family before the incident. 

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@elated   I did read it before I posted.

There is nothing there to indicate that the father had made previous suicidal remarks.

The police received a call that the child had been left in the car; THEN they received additional information that the father was making suicidal remarks.

The issue is this:  When and how were the police told about those remarks?

The timeline has not been established and so far the investigation indicates the toddler was left in the car by accident.

It has not been established that when the mom became concerned when the daycare called her she knew the child was already deceased; she was concerned something had happened.

We can surmise she tried to contact the father and at that point he indicated he was making those statements.

Unless the investigation proves otherwise, I stand with the premise that the remarks were made after he found his child dead.

We have no proof of prior mental illness regarding suicidal remarks.

Your statement "I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal" is putting the blame on the mother when it has never been established that those remarks had been made before.

[Porcelain]

Always been plenty of unbalanced dumb people out there. Many of them are parents. Lots of survivors out there who could have easily been killed by a parent at many points in their childhood.

I'm looking forward to new initiatives to save the lives of these children from dying at the hands of their parents.

What does everyone want to do to fix this? Good intentions can't beat human stupidity, distraction, and temporary emotional problems.

If a bad parent were capable of thinking ahead to weigh possible jailing for manslaughter or murder, they wouldn't be the kind of person who could leave their child in a hot car to begin with. They'd be smart, not stupid. Careful, not careless. The response must be proactive, not after the fact when it's too late and yet another baby is dead.

[elated]

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@elated wrote:

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@elated wrote:

I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal. What is wrong with people. If you want to take your life, don't take some innocent person with you. Where is common sense or humanity!!!

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@elated  Some others have already posted about the suicide remark-that it is unknown when he made the remark.  It could have been AFTER he discovered his son and I agree with that point.

The fact that he brought his son into the house indicates love and despair, not a deliberate act of murder and suicide.

We don't know the full timeline so I'm not going to judge the mom.

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If you read the third paragraph @gertrudecloset , the suicidal statement was made to the mother and family before the incident. 

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@elated   I did read it before I posted.

There is nothing there to indicate that the father had made previous suicidal remarks.

The police received a call that the child had been left in the car; THEN they received additional information that the father was making suicidal remarks.

The issue is this:  When and how were the police told about those remarks?

The timeline has not been established and so far the investigation indicates the toddler was left in the car by accident.

It has not been established that when the mom became concerned when the daycare called her she knew the child was already deceased; she was concerned something had happened.

We can surmise she tried to contact the father and at that point he indicated he was making those statements.

Unless the investigation proves otherwise, I stand with the premise that the remarks were made after he found his child dead.

We have no proof of prior mental illness regarding suicidal remarks.

Your statement "I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal" is putting the blame on the mother when it has never been established that those remarks had been made before.

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At about 11:42 am police received a call indicating an 18-month old male child may have been left in an unattended vehicle for several hours.

Police soon received additional information indicating the child's father was at the residence in the 14100 block of Alternate Road and was making suicidal statements.

[Cakers3]

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@elated wrote:

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@elated wrote:

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@Cakers3 wrote:

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@elated wrote:

I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal. What is wrong with people. If you want to take your life, don't take some innocent person with you. Where is common sense or humanity!!!

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@elated  Some others have already posted about the suicide remark-that it is unknown when he made the remark.  It could have been AFTER he discovered his son and I agree with that point.

The fact that he brought his son into the house indicates love and despair, not a deliberate act of murder and suicide.

We don't know the full timeline so I'm not going to judge the mom.

---

If you read the third paragraph @gertrudecloset , the suicidal statement was made to the mother and family before the incident. 

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@elated   I did read it before I posted.

There is nothing there to indicate that the father had made previous suicidal remarks.

The police received a call that the child had been left in the car; THEN they received additional information that the father was making suicidal remarks.

The issue is this:  When and how were the police told about those remarks?

The timeline has not been established and so far the investigation indicates the toddler was left in the car by accident.

It has not been established that when the mom became concerned when the daycare called her she knew the child was already deceased; she was concerned something had happened.

We can surmise she tried to contact the father and at that point he indicated he was making those statements.

Unless the investigation proves otherwise, I stand with the premise that the remarks were made after he found his child dead.

We have no proof of prior mental illness regarding suicidal remarks.

Your statement "I don't understand why the child's mother allowed the father to take her son. She knew he was suicidal" is putting the blame on the mother when it has never been established that those remarks had been made before.

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At about 11:42 am police received a call indicating an 18-month old male child may have been left in an unattended vehicle for several hours.

Police soon received additional information indicating the child's father was at the residence in the 14100 block of Alternate Road and was making suicidal statements.

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@elated   Yes, we know that.  That is not the point.

I'm not going to keep going back and forth with you on this.

You can keep posting the time of day and that the police received additional info about the suicidal remarks.

It doesn't prove your earlier statement that the mother knew he was suicidal yet let him take the toddler.

THAT is the point.  There is nothing to indicate a history of suicidal remarks.  Nothing.

You do you, though.