Beauty

[Harpa]

I am only half-heartily reading, and didn't want to join in the controversies.

I just want to say that none of Paula's BHA products have done a smidge for me ever. AHAs, emphatically yes; her 8% is a great way to introduce your skin to them. I've only ever gotten results from other BHA products. I have no clue why, it is just my experience.

Once she started selling her own product line, she should have given up the other. Either-Or. Because now she is not an independent source of information, no matter how many products she reviews or how many or what kind of studies she cites.

I can make a further case about certain ingredients, but this post is really only about her own BHA products (and I've tried her several strengths.) Again, I have no idea why they were not effective.

[twins mom]

On 6/1/2014 suzyQ3 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

Did I erroneously read yesterday that she pays people to recruit for her products? Something about a link that was posted that went back to someone's account where she herself would receive a kick back for new customers?

Was it deleted because I read nothing further about it afterwards.....or perhaps I just couldn't find the answer...

Paula lost a lot of credibility for myself when she started reviewing her own products and rated them BEST. I think that was a conflict of interest leading me to now always question her reviews. But I know she has her loyal followers.....I read every one of her books myself and she has changed over the years her opinions of products. In her earlier books she didn't think anyone needed a toner and now she sells one herself.

This reminds me of the telephone game, except that it is much more dangerous because it maligns a company.

A poster recommended PC and included a link that could supposedly be used to get a 10 percent discount.

Then blondelle accused that poster of trying to game PC's Refer-a-Friend program, which you cannot do by just posting a link. Either way, though, that doesn't reflect poorly on the company. They do have a refer-a-friend program, as do many companies.

Then twins mom said something indecipherable to me and others about not liking being asked or others being asked to advertise for PC. I'm sorry, but I can't remember it verbatim, especially since I really had no idea what she was talking about.

I and someone else asked her what she was referring to, but as far as I know, she never answered. If anyone would be asked to pitch for PC, I would think it would be I, since I am such an ardent fan of their products, but so far, I have to wait for promo codes and sales just like everyone else.

So there you have the big reveal and scandal about Paula's Choice.

No one is maligning the company but some cosmetics companies (ie Isomers) feels Paula has maligned them. Paula reviews should be taken as an opinion.... and we all have learned a lot from Paula. I buy one product from her.... her 10% acne cream because it is good and cheap but the other products didn't work for me... Mary Kay didn't work for me either... but to having people citing books, saying they are experts because it is their profession and saying they are right about everything really isn't a discussion... it is lecture...and sweetheart you are fine... I am not talking about you.... I am glad you like all of the products... I do better with SKINN am/pm cleansers and Dermapeel which I am sure are highly nonrecommended by Paula which is ok... My skin became about 100% better within 3 months after I stopped using Paula's product... and that is a fact for me!

[blueskies]

And btw , if anyone has info about other sites like PC , that give unbiased advise re: skincare and makeup , please feel free to discuss it here . Anyone can google for that info , but personal experiences with those sites are helpful .

[serenity4ever]

On 6/1/2014 suzyQ3 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

Did I erroneously read yesterday that she pays people to recruit for her products? Something about a link that was posted that went back to someone's account where she herself would receive a kick back for new customers?

Was it deleted because I read nothing further about it afterwards.....or perhaps I just couldn't find the answer...

Paula lost a lot of credibility for myself when she started reviewing her own products and rated them BEST. I think that was a conflict of interest leading me to now always question her reviews. But I know she has her loyal followers.....I read every one of her books myself and she has changed over the years her opinions of products. In her earlier books she didn't think anyone needed a toner and now she sells one herself.

This reminds me of the telephone game, except that it is much more dangerous because it maligns a company.

A poster recommended PC and included a link that could supposedly be used to get a 10 percent discount.

Then blondelle accused that poster of trying to game PC's Refer-a-Friend program, which you cannot do by just posting a link. Either way, though, that doesn't reflect poorly on the company. They do have a refer-a-friend program, as do many companies.

Then twins mom said something indecipherable to me and others about not liking being asked or others being asked to advertise for PC. I'm sorry, but I can't remember it verbatim, especially since I really had no idea what she was talking about.

I and someone else asked her what she was referring to, but as far as I know, she never answered. If anyone would be asked to pitch for PC, I would think it would be I, since I am such an ardent fan of their products, but so far, I have to wait for promo codes and sales just like everyone else.

So there you have the big reveal and scandal about Paula's Choice.

Thanks for clearing that up. Clearly, much ado about nothing.

[Irshgrl31201]

On 6/1/2014 Tune Up said:

Irish Girl -

I have a funny feeling anything anyone found you'd fight about it.

There are a ton of contradictions from Paula and quess what, I haven't even touch base on the natural skin market. I can guarantee your derm will not have current editions of the few books I mentioned and there are many more books back with scientific research the authors performed not borrowed and not obscure.

Look at Paula's ingredients and reference her books and you'll see exactly what I'm typing about but I'm not sure you'll be able to admit it.

You're a fan I get that and I've tried to be respectful because of that.

We both have strong opinions and I think I've proved mine and told everyone where they can go and see what I'm typing about.

I'm not a fan so we will not get anywhere.

I thought we were having a discussion, not a fight. Actually there are lots of things I won't "fight" about as you refer to it. You won't see me in topics I don't know about. I won't ever be over in Electronics, For the Home, Health and Fitness, etc.. because I don't know enough about it to present a good argument either for or against. However skincare, I do.

I admit when I am wrong all the time. I am smart enough to know that I do not know everything even in skincare. I do know a lot. I would not want to be a person who couldn't learn something every day. Even more I wouldn't want to miss out on a new study that disproved something that was a widely held belief. There is absolutely no shame into coming to a new conclusion based on new science (in any topic not just medical or skincare)

I am also not against natural ingredients. There are lots of great ones out there but there are also bad ones being masqueraded around as good ones just because they are natural. The natural bandwagon has gotten me and the derms I work for lots of new clients because they can be just as dangerous as synthetic ones. All natural doesn't mean all good. Sulfuric acid is natural.

[suzyQ3]

On 6/1/2014 twins mom said:

On 6/1/2014 suzyQ3 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

Did I erroneously read yesterday that she pays people to recruit for her products? Something about a link that was posted that went back to someone's account where she herself would receive a kick back for new customers?

Was it deleted because I read nothing further about it afterwards.....or perhaps I just couldn't find the answer...

Paula lost a lot of credibility for myself when she started reviewing her own products and rated them BEST. I think that was a conflict of interest leading me to now always question her reviews. But I know she has her loyal followers.....I read every one of her books myself and she has changed over the years her opinions of products. In her earlier books she didn't think anyone needed a toner and now she sells one herself.

This reminds me of the telephone game, except that it is much more dangerous because it maligns a company.

A poster recommended PC and included a link that could supposedly be used to get a 10 percent discount.

Then blondelle accused that poster of trying to game PC's Refer-a-Friend program, which you cannot do by just posting a link. Either way, though, that doesn't reflect poorly on the company. They do have a refer-a-friend program, as do many companies.

Then twins mom said something indecipherable to me and others about not liking being asked or others being asked to advertise for PC. I'm sorry, but I can't remember it verbatim, especially since I really had no idea what she was talking about.

I and someone else asked her what she was referring to, but as far as I know, she never answered. If anyone would be asked to pitch for PC, I would think it would be I, since I am such an ardent fan of their products, but so far, I have to wait for promo codes and sales just like everyone else.

So there you have the big reveal and scandal about Paula's Choice.

No one is maligning the company but some cosmetics companies (ie Isomers) feels Paula has maligned them. Paula reviews should be taken as an opinion.... and we all have learned a lot from Paula. I buy one product from her.... her 10% acne cream because it is good and cheap but the other products didn't work for me... Mary Kay didn't work for me either... but to having people citing books, saying they are experts because it is their profession and saying they are right about everything really isn't a discussion... it is lecture...and sweetheart you are fine... I am not talking about you.... I am glad you like all of the products... I do better with SKINN am/pm cleansers and Dermapeel which I am sure are highly nonrecommended by Paula which is ok... My skin became about 100% better within 3 months after I stopped using Paula's product... and that is a fact for me!

Oh, but it is maligning the company to say that the company uses ingredients that the company itself rates as potentially dangerous. That's the reason I asked for examples.

And of course some companies feel maligned by a bad review. But I'm equally sure that companies appreciate when they get a good review.

I'm sure that companies feel maligned also by beauty guru videos or blogs that give them a bad review. It goes with the territory. Now, if something is said that is flat-out incorrect, then the company can take legal action.

I personally appreciate that I can get some info on a product that isn't just anecdotal, as is MUA. I like to have both to help me make a decision.

[serenity4ever]

On 6/1/2014 Irshgrl31201 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

On 6/1/2014 Irshgrl31201 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

Did I erroneously read yesterday that she pays people to recruit for her products? Something about a link that was posted that went back to someone's account where she herself would receive a kick back for new customers?

Was it deleted because I read nothing further about it afterwards.....or perhaps I just couldn't find the answer...

Paula lost a lot of credibility for myself when she started reviewing her own products and rated them BEST. I think that was a conflict of interest leading me to now always question her reviews. But I know she has her loyal followers.....I read every one of her books myself and she has changed over the years her opinions of products. In her earlier books she didn't think anyone needed a toner and now she sells one herself.

Paula has a refer a friend program. If you refer a friend and they use your link then you get $10 credited to your account. Someone here used their link for another poster. That is on the poster, not Paula. That is against the rules here and should not have been done here but many companies have refer a friend programs. Hardly the scandal it was made out to be.

She does rate her products best. She developed them to her specifications off the latest research in science.

As for toners, she still thinks if you have a proper cleanser there isn't a need for one. Many of her clients don't feel they truly get rid of all traces of makeup unless you use one, (thanks to a lie from the beauty industry) so after consumer requests she developed one bypassing all the ingredients she found to be culprits for bad toners. Her biggest gripe with toners were that most contained bad alcohols. Putting alcohol in a toner only causes the skin to produce more oil because it tricks the skin into thinking it is drying and ruining the acid mantle. They were also loaded with irritating ingredients that added nothing to calm, soothe or cleanse the skin. Ingredients like menthol, eucalyptus, mint, peppermint which add tingles to the skin to give the user a false feeling of clean and fresh when they really contribute to cell death. She added BHA's which actually clean the pore wall.

Thanks, Irish for the explanation.

I always enjoy reading your posts and I think you have a wealth of knowledge on the subject of beauty. I have learned so much from you and please continue to share. I stopped using a product on your recommendation awhile back and my skin is clear and I no longer have any redness. I wish you had a book out. I would love reading your experiences in the industry.

Hope you are feeling better. You had a real scare last night and I think you did the right thing going to the ER. Please take care of yourself.

Hi Serenity! Thank you for your sweet posts on the other thread. I was in so much pain last night. It was awful and embarrassing. Thank God for steroids and pain meds. I feel so much better today.

My daughter is pregnant and due in July. I have decided to take a long leave of absence in my job (keeping a handful of long time clients) and stay at home to watch my new grandson. My son in law is a computer guru and I am starting a beauty blog with makeup and skin care advice. Most of the emphasis will be on skin care. I am not exactly sure if it will be up in August or September but that is the goal date. I will give you a link if you are interested.

Again, thank you so much for your concern.

Glad to hear you are on the mend. I would really enjoy reading your blog and would very much appreciate the link. I bet you can't wait for the arrival of your new grandson! Mine just turned 18 months old last month and he is just a sweetie pie....

[Irshgrl31201]

On 6/1/2014 suzyQ3 said:

On 6/1/2014 Irshgrl31201 said:

On 6/1/2014 twins mom said:

Irish Girl is getting so fanatical about her Paula support I am starting to suspect (1) she might be Paula B... (2) she has some financial or personal interest in the company... (3) she is one of Paula's family members or (4) she is Paula's friend. I think she has an extreme case of tunnel vision. Irish Girl... for me and probably several others on here you have lost credibility with your audience... and I also think it is interesting you don't know about the baking soda and the Cetaphil which IMO work much better than most of PCs products... expecially the AHA/BHA things....

I am not getting fanatical at all. Having a discussion and clearing up some misconceptions. If I were a member of PC by family or business I wouldn't have to be on here because she is doing just fine on its own.

As for baking soda, while it is a wonderful spherical shape that makes it ideal for a scrub the pH is way too high and that causes bacteria to harbor. It is not ideal for the skin at all. pH didn't used to be considered at all when skin care was involved years ago but it is now that we realize how important it is to keep the pH at good levels for optimal results.

As for Cetaphil. That was a good state of the art cleanser about 25 yrs ago. It is good for people with very sensitive skin but it hasn't been cutting edge in quite a while. There are much more options out there now that are so much better.

Also, AHA's and BHA's aren't for everyone. Some people cannot handle them but they are the first suggestion by derm all over the country for proper chemical exfoliation. People are over exfoliating too much with physical exfoliants.

Irish Girl, you and I have not always seen eye to eye on other issues way back in the past, but I have always respected your well-reasoned posts on skin care. I have never found you to be fanatical (that made me laugh, considering the tone of some posts here) nor arrogant, btw.

Personally, I don't give a rat's behind what others think about my choices or about a particular company. Why would I?

My only stake here is that I object to misrepresentations and statements made by someone(s) who refuses to back them up.

Thank you SuzyQ3. I feel just the same about you. I don't think it is mandatory to agree about every issue but you disagree like a lady. That is always appreciated by me and I am sure others.

I know, fanatical made me laugh too. I don't think I was rude in my discussion. Just asking for examples so I could be clear.

What are you going to do? Can't please everyone all the time.

[Irshgrl31201]

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

On 6/1/2014 Irshgrl31201 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

On 6/1/2014 Irshgrl31201 said:

On 6/1/2014 serenity4ever said:

Did I erroneously read yesterday that she pays people to recruit for her products? Something about a link that was posted that went back to someone's account where she herself would receive a kick back for new customers?

Was it deleted because I read nothing further about it afterwards.....or perhaps I just couldn't find the answer...

Paula lost a lot of credibility for myself when she started reviewing her own products and rated them BEST. I think that was a conflict of interest leading me to now always question her reviews. But I know she has her loyal followers.....I read every one of her books myself and she has changed over the years her opinions of products. In her earlier books she didn't think anyone needed a toner and now she sells one herself.

Paula has a refer a friend program. If you refer a friend and they use your link then you get $10 credited to your account. Someone here used their link for another poster. That is on the poster, not Paula. That is against the rules here and should not have been done here but many companies have refer a friend programs. Hardly the scandal it was made out to be.

She does rate her products best. She developed them to her specifications off the latest research in science.

As for toners, she still thinks if you have a proper cleanser there isn't a need for one. Many of her clients don't feel they truly get rid of all traces of makeup unless you use one, (thanks to a lie from the beauty industry) so after consumer requests she developed one bypassing all the ingredients she found to be culprits for bad toners. Her biggest gripe with toners were that most contained bad alcohols. Putting alcohol in a toner only causes the skin to produce more oil because it tricks the skin into thinking it is drying and ruining the acid mantle. They were also loaded with irritating ingredients that added nothing to calm, soothe or cleanse the skin. Ingredients like menthol, eucalyptus, mint, peppermint which add tingles to the skin to give the user a false feeling of clean and fresh when they really contribute to cell death. She added BHA's which actually clean the pore wall.

Thanks, Irish for the explanation.

I always enjoy reading your posts and I think you have a wealth of knowledge on the subject of beauty. I have learned so much from you and please continue to share. I stopped using a product on your recommendation awhile back and my skin is clear and I no longer have any redness. I wish you had a book out. I would love reading your experiences in the industry.

Hope you are feeling better. You had a real scare last night and I think you did the right thing going to the ER. Please take care of yourself.

Hi Serenity! Thank you for your sweet posts on the other thread. I was in so much pain last night. It was awful and embarrassing. Thank God for steroids and pain meds. I feel so much better today.

My daughter is pregnant and due in July. I have decided to take a long leave of absence in my job (keeping a handful of long time clients) and stay at home to watch my new grandson. My son in law is a computer guru and I am starting a beauty blog with makeup and skin care advice. Most of the emphasis will be on skin care. I am not exactly sure if it will be up in August or September but that is the goal date. I will give you a link if you are interested.

Again, thank you so much for your concern.

Glad to hear you are on the mend. I would really enjoy reading your blog and would very much appreciate the link. I bet you can't wait for the arrival of your new grandson! Mine just turned 18 months old last month and he is just a sweetie pie....

Oh Serenity, I cannot wait. 18 months is a great age because they have a good understanding and can communicate. I will try not to rush my new little guy though. Enjoy your grandchild, I can't wait to enjoy mine.

[Andreatoo]

tune up: although your disdain for Paula is clear the reasons why are less so. You said quite a bit without saying a whole lot and I say that with all due respect because others just drop bombs and run away not to be heard from again. And sometimes those bombs are simply lies. I respect your right to your opinion and you're right to consider her practices unethical although I haven't heard any examples of either her unethical practices nor her poor research! I have however heard or I should say read her own admission that her recommendation of using baking soda as a natural household exfoliant to be in error and she openly admits it.