topic Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines in Travel

60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

FrostyBabe1 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 21:24:23 GMT

Did anyone else see this piece on Sunday night? It was a "double" length segment and took up nearly 40 minutes of the show. Not only was it terrifying, I'm absolutely shocked that after the in-depth expose' done by the Tampa Bay Times in late 2016, nothing has changed. It is beyond me how they still have a valid operating certificate!

I have friends that fly Allegiant quite often because it's cheap. You couldn't pay me enough to set foot on one of their aircraft.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

golding76 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:02:30 GMT

I am sorry I missed this. One of the comments in reply to the engine that blew on today's Southwest flight to Dallas grabbed my attention big-time. I worked in Flight Standards at FAA (not as an aviation safety inspector), and the reorganization had just begun before I retired.

Point No. 5 in the comment below was of great importance to me.

1. The FAA organization responsible for oversight of the airlines is Flight Standards. In 2017, the FAA’s Flight Standards organization underwent a dramatic restructuring. Regional offices were eliminated. Flight Standards was streamlined for efficiency. FAA HQ has more control over the oversight process. https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/?newsId=88644 https://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/FAA-Reorganization-Formalized-230395-1.html
2. Here is the old organization chart for FAA’s Flight Standards:https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/media/April_2017_Current_AFS-1_Org_Chart_Divison_and_Deputy_sans_names.pdf
3. Here is the new org chart: https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/media/AFSreorg-2.png
4. Has anyone reviewed the FAA’s new organizational approach for Flight Standards to ensure the flying public is being safeguarded? Does the new deployment of resources provide better or worse oversight of the airlines? DOT’s Office of Inspector General (OIG) has not evaluated the new Flight Standards organizational approach. The Government Accountability Office (GAO) has not reviewed it either.
5. DOT OIG did review FAA’s oversight of regional carriers in 2017. OIG identified flaws in the FAA's oversight of regional carriers. https://www.oig.dot.gov/sites/default/files/Final%20Report-Regional%20Airlines-AV2018012.pdf

Of interest to me is that over 50 years ago, then-FAA Administrator Najeeb Halaby decentralized the Agency (FAA), having all regions mirror the organization of FAA Headquarters. Now, the reverse has occurred. Fifty years hence, will operations be decentralized once again?.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

FrostyBabe1 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 21:54:35 GMT

@golding76 -

You can watch the segment on-line. Just go to the 60 Minutes website, or you can also access it through both the CBS and 60 Minutes facebook pages.

Also, as to point number 5 above...I've scanned the document very briefly, and I'm sure the findings are scary, but isn't it specific just to regional carriers? Those such as SkyWest and GoJet that operate smaller aircraft under the banner of a mainline carrier such as Delta, American or United? Although I only live 5 miles from my local airport in MI, we only get the regional jets so I go to a different airport about 45 miles away to fly on mainline metal.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

golding76 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 21:58:15 GMT

Thank you, Frosty Babe. Those with less experience fly regional aircraft. That is where they go to get their hours and get hired by a major carrier.

I came away from FAA with two bits of advice that I try to follow at all costs:

1. Do not fly regional aircraft.

2. Avoid flying through Chicago in the winter and Atlanta in the summer.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

drizzellla — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:03:44 GMT

Looks like Southwest is now in the hot seat.

PHILADELPHIA – One person is dead after jet engine caught fire and a piece of shrapnel pierced a window, partially sucking a woman out of a plane, and forcing an emergency landing at Philadelphia International Airport Tuesday morning, National Transportation Safety Board Chairman Robert Sumwalt said in a press conference Tuesday afternoon

It's not clear yet if the person who was nearly sucked out of the plane is the passenger who died as Sumwalt said no additional information was available.

KOAT News in Albuquerque, New Mexico has identified the person killed as Jennifer Riordan of Albuquerque.

Southwest Airlines flight #1380, heading to Dallas from New York, was forced to land at the airport at about 11 a.m. Tuesday, April 17.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

golding76 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:18:11 GMT

I can tell you one thing, Bob Sumwalt of the NTSB is a brilliant and solid investigator. He spoke at our office once, and I was able to chat with him. Bob leaves no stone unturned. He and his colleagues will painstakingly research what went wrong and discover the exact cause(s) for that failure(s).

The NTSB is beyond reproach, in my eyes. They make their carefully thought out recommendations after pursuing every fact and theory. It is then up to FAA to carry out those recommendations. Because of FAA's limited resources (hey, Congress, more money, please!) and the airlines' resistance to incurring heavy expense to enact necessary changes, not every recommendation is acted upon.

Very sad. Look at the railroads and that signal NTSB recommended after the Philadelphia crash. There recently was another crash that could have been prevented had NTSB's recommendation been carried out at all specified areas.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

winamac1 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:17:39 GMT

@golding76 wrote:
Thank you, Frosty Babe. Those with less experience fly regional aircraft. That is where they go to get their hours and get hired by a major carrier.

I came away from FAA with two bits of advice that I try to follow at all costs:

1. Do not fly regional aircraft.

2. Avoid flying through Chicago in the winter and Atlanta in the summer.

Why not Atlanta in the summer?

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

golding76 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:18:35 GMT

Hurricanes and windstorms.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

FrostyBabe1 — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:31:38 GMT

@drizzellla wrote:
Looks like Southwest is now in the hot seat.

PHILADELPHIA – One person is dead after jet engine caught fire and a piece of shrapnel pierced a window, partially sucking a woman out of a plane, and forcing an emergency landing at Philadelphia International Airport Tuesday morning, National Transportation Safety Board Chairman Robert Sumwalt said in a press conference Tuesday afternoon
It's not clear yet if the person who was nearly sucked out of the plane is the passenger who died as Sumwalt said no additional information was available.
KOAT News in Albuquerque, New Mexico has identified the person killed as Jennifer Riordan of Albuquerque.
Southwest Airlines flight #1380, heading to Dallas from New York, was forced to land at the airport at about 11 a.m. Tuesday, April 17.

It's far too early to know what caused this terrible accident, and editorializing with comments like the one above serves no purpose but to stir the pot. The NTSB will investigate, investigate again and then investigate some more. IF they find something to blame on the part of the airline they'll make those findings known. Let's let them do their investigation, shall we?

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

itsmagic — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 23:17:56 GMT

@FrostyBabe1 I did see the piece on 60 Minutes re Allegiant Air. We flew on Allegiant just last month. I had no idea they had so many incidents when we flew with them.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

Chicagosuburbangirl — Wed, 18 Apr 2018 00:36:35 GMT

After working for a major airline for 23 years, IMHO is to stick with the big carriers.

If your aircraft goes out of service, chances are better (read not guaranteed) that alternate equipment will be available.

With most of the smaller carriers the aircraft fleet size is much smaller.

Also, I always felt operations were done by the book, consistently.

Truly hardworking people.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

Kachina624 — Wed, 18 Apr 2018 05:29:35 GMT

The Albuquerque TV stations have talked of little else but the death of this woman today. She was an outstanding citizen, a veep at Wells Fargo Bank, and her husband was a high ranking official with city government until the recent election. They even had an interview of the two of them done a couple years ago.

A passenger on the plane said she was sucked out the window to her waist; head and arms were outside. They gave her CPR but she was too far gone.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

Junker2327 — Wed, 18 Apr 2018 14:23:50 GMT

Im getting ready to go on a trip in two weeks on Allegiant. I hope everything goes ok.

Beckyblu

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

golding76 — Wed, 18 Apr 2018 14:59:21 GMT

Was able to watch the "60 Minutes" piece on Allegiant. Could not help but cringe when FAA's spokesperson (I don't want to name him -- he is a very nice guy, by the way) appeared intent on presenting an "impartial" stance on Allegiant's myriad problems. But understand, the FAA must be as impartial as it can be or the airlines might not cooperate well. Very delicate position for FAA.

Fortunately, the FOIA process finally allowed Allegiant's records to be released. The truth should be found, to some degree, in the records.

Self-reporting by airlines is ridiculous to me, but I am not on the aviation knowledge level of those who make the big decisions. To me, it is like asking a husband who cheats by nature to report when he has flirted or actually been fully unfaithful each time he is at fault. How true will his self-report be?

Airlines have proved time and time again that the most important thing is the bottom line. That is a truth. Death and injury to passengers is collateral damage.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

Blk&GoldFan — Wed, 18 Apr 2018 19:38:15 GMT

Although this has no casualties with this airline snafu, it certainly caught my interest when reported on the news yesterday. Sun Country airlines out of MN cancelled a few flights due to blizzard conditions and it was there last seasonal flights. Passengers stranded in two Mexican cities were told the next flights would be available in June!! Can you imagine getting that message on your phone while waiting to depart to return to jobs/school?

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

itsmagic — Thu, 19 Apr 2018 12:54:18 GMT

@Blk&GoldFan

I saw that on the news too. I think I later saw that after the bad publicity Sun Country was stepping up and in addition to a refund would pay for the difference in price for a flight with another carrier. I’m thinking when I travel I need to stay with the larger airlines and pay the higher price.

Re: 60 Minutes - Allegiant Airlines

Vivian — Sat, 28 Apr 2018 18:16:24 GMT

My kids moved to Orlando in 2001 and Allegiant flies directly there from a nearby city. I did my homework from day 1 and knew about the problems at Allegiant. I will never fly with them. I have friends who fly with Allegiant because of price but I will only fly directly on JetBlue out of Syracuse or Southwest out of Rochester. Of course, now that I know about the tragedy on Southwest I may think twice before flying with them.