topic Re: Need Ideas in WEN

Need Ideas

Puppymom1 — Wed, 04 Nov 2020 17:00:08 GMT

Hi everyone!! I have been reading your posts for a good while. I have tons of WEN just like everyone here so that's why i feel OK posting...

I have been consistent with WEN for probably 3 months. I have some good days and some pretty yucky ones. Yucky days mean my hair feels "heavy". It won't hold a curl or stay where I put it, it just flops. I have short hair and it is poker straight. I am using 3-4 pumps of TT or WWB on the first cleanse and 2 pumps each of 613 and BSI on the second. Then about a half pump of leave in with 1 pump styling cream.

So on a whim this morning, I tried a tweaked by nature product and my hair is behaving very nicely! Nuts, I really want the WEN to work. I need some ideas on what I can do differently to get better results.

I welcome ALL and ANY suggestions! So glad to finally dip my toes into the forum.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Re: Need Ideas

quadmimi — Wed, 04 Nov 2020 17:12:27 GMT

@Puppymom1 wrote:
Hi everyone!! I have been reading your posts for a good while. I have tons of WEN just like everyone here so that's why i feel OK posting...

I have been consistent with WEN for probably 3 months. I have some good days and some pretty yucky ones. Yucky days mean my hair feels "heavy". It won't hold a curl or stay where I put it, it just flops. I have short hair and it is poker straight. I am using 3-4 pumps of TT or WWB on the first cleanse and 2 pumps each of 613 and BSI on the second. Then about a half pump of leave in with 1 pump styling cream.

So on a whim this morning, I tried a tweaked by nature product and my hair is behaving very nicely! Nuts, I really want the WEN to work. I need some ideas on what I can do differently to get better results.

I welcome ALL and ANY suggestions! So glad to finally dip my toes into the forum.

Thanks in advance for your help.

@Puppymom1

I am not sure if your hair is thick or thin, I know you said it's short..

I have very baby fine hair, somewhat curly...

I pre-mix my Wen with water (in a little plastic bowl) so it's much thinner when I use it..( I mix my Wen CC's together mostly) so I make enough for both cleanses.

I use a brush that you would put hair color on your head to whip it up) It goes on much better for my thin hair than right from the bottle..I always comb it thru the ends with CHaz's wide tooth comb both cleanses.

Rinse well & a tiny bit of CC leave in, not much. I don't use styling cream as I don't use a blow dryer..I do use the mousse.

I just mix a batch up the night before & its ready to go in the morning..

I am sure others will be able to give you great info also.

I would never use anything else on my hair, but I did have to play with it a bit...

Re: Need Ideas

LindaSal — Wed, 04 Nov 2020 17:24:28 GMT

@Puppymom1 Hi there, I've been a Wen girl for about 8 years now. It does take some training for sure. I have short naturally curly hair, almost a pixie type style. What I found for me and Chaz may say it's a no no........but I stopped putting the CC as a leave in and only use the styling cream after my cleanse and then a bit of mousse. I feel less is more for most things in life and this works for me. However, I am also a Tweak'd fan and love those products too. Just recently I have been alternating.

Re: Need Ideas

World Traveler — Wed, 04 Nov 2020 17:28:39 GMT

@LindaSal Interesting. I do the opposite....use the leave-in, but not stying cream. ha! We definitely are all different in what works best for us when it comes to WEN.

@LindaSal wrote:
@Puppymom1Hi there, I've been a Wen girl for about 8 years now. It does take some training for sure. I have short naturally curly hair, almost a pixie type style. What I found for me and Chaz may say it's a no no........but I stopped putting the CC as a leave in and only use the styling cream after my cleanse and then a bit of mousse. I feel less is more for most things in life and this works for me. However, I am also a Tweak'd fan and love those products too. Just recently I have been alternating.

Re: Need Ideas

NYCLatinaMe — Wed, 04 Nov 2020 19:57:44 GMT

Definitely skip the leave in. That should help some.

Re: Need Ideas

CamilleP — Wed, 04 Nov 2020 20:33:24 GMT

@Puppymom1 I also have very fine hair, but it's shoulder length. I also think you should skip the CC as leave-in and only use styling creme, IF you are using hot tools like blow dryers or curling irons. If you are air-drying and not using any tools or devices, you may not even need that. You might also consider mousse instead of CC, as it is also conditioning, but much lighter. I know Chaz's general recommendation is to always use CC as a leave-in, but some heads of hair just don't support it. If you keep your hair quite short and trimmed regularly, you may not need the extra conditioning the leave-in provides, especially given the extreme conditioning you are getting from 613 and BSI, two of the most intensive CC's Chaz makes. Hope this helps.

Re: Need Ideas

tsavorite — Thu, 05 Nov 2020 00:15:21 GMT

I am VERY new to WEN so take what I say with a grain of salt LOL! But I notice you are using 613 and Bella Spirit? Think I have that correct. I tried those but they both made my hair very flat...for me these just don't work well with my hair type.

I have found now which ones seem to work best for me and plan on sticking with them.

Also sometimes when we try something new...since it's very different for what our hair is used to we get a super great response. Tweaked may work for you...and you can inter-change between both lines to use up what you have. I tried one of his products and it made my hair very voluminous/full...but after a few uses my super curly hair got dry and crunchy.

I have had to play alot to figure out what is best for me. I do use a small (dime) amount of CC as leave...have short hair...and no issues with that at all. IF I used more then that? My hair would be flat and I would want to wash it daily then. I also blow out part of my hair so I need some protection.

Re: Need Ideas

ANewHue — Thu, 05 Nov 2020 02:59:56 GMT

Welcome. Well you did say your hair is short but you didn’t say whether it was thin or thick. I think the number of pumps you are using could be a factor, remember more Wen is better than not enough. Just make sure you rinse really well between cleanses. Another issue could be the 613 / BSI combo. I have fine hair and although I adore 613 using it incorporated in my second cleanse every time was not good for me. It gave me flyaways and my hair was a pouf. It was too much protein. So I would try skipping it to ever other cleanse and see what happens. Good luck! There is a learning curve , you’ll find what works best for your hair.

Re: Need Ideas

Puppymom1 — Thu, 05 Nov 2020 15:29:16 GMT

Never thought of protein but that may be the reason it flops. My hair is probably thick, certainly no thin. My hairdresser says I have the best hair of all her clients, yeah me. I will try diluting, not adding a leave in and not use the BSI or 613 for a few cleanses and see where we go.

Thank you ALL for you help, the WENNERS are truly a great bunch.

Re: Need Ideas

riley1 — Fri, 06 Nov 2020 14:00:41 GMT

@Puppymom1 - How short is your hair? Maybe the amount of pumps you are using is just too much for your hair length/type. Or, it could be the "splash" of water you are adding - not enough. Another thought, don't use the 613/BS together - either use them singly or combine with another seasonal.

Good Luck - there is a definite learning curve to find the best combo for your hair.

Re: Need Ideas

Puppymom1 — Fri, 06 Nov 2020 14:34:06 GMT

My hair is about 2 inches below my ears. I am using about 4 pumps for each cleanse. You are all correct, I think it was the leave in. I didn't use it this morning, just a pump of styling cream and some mousse. My hair is full and feels great. That is the clincher I think but will keep playing around. I thought I had to do everything as Chaz said but I now feel OK about playing around with things. Thanks for ALL of your help.

Re: Need Ideas

CamilleP — Fri, 06 Nov 2020 18:33:37 GMT

@Puppymom1 If your hair is chin length, you might consider using 5 pumps of CC per cleanse, especially if your hair is fairly thick. You might find you get much more body and bounce if your hair is a little cleaner. Also, don't be afraid to really add quite a bit of water to each cleanse, your hair will feel almost like a shampoo because the WEN will be so frothy, but it will be creamy and silky to the touch, not squeaky-crunchy, like shampoo does. I am glad to hear that just using styling creme and mousse are giving you results you like better, I've found that to be the case as well, and I don't even usually heat-style.

Re: Need Ideas

x Hedge — Fri, 06 Nov 2020 19:12:38 GMT

@Puppymom1

1. More water (always). Should be very frothy and drippy wet during the cleanse.

2. You're using first & second tier treatment levels on your first cleanse, then third tier (richest treatment level) on your second cleanse, and that's the one that really plumps up the hair shaft if you don't rush and rinse it out right away.

You're using 7 to 8 pumps total.

Try 5 on the first cleanse and only 2 or 3 on the second cleanse, plus one of the lighter WEN formulas as your leave in.

But always lots of water.

I can "over treat" with 613 now. Just "flops", as you said.

At first I could use 613 for both cleanses and leave in. As my hair improved I started using a lighter WEN for my first cleanse. Now I generally only use 613 as my leave in, except in winter when I can do second cleanse with it.

Perhaps your hair no longer needs such a rich treatment on the second cleanse.

Re: Need Ideas

77yangya — Sat, 07 Nov 2020 10:44:40 GMT

I always make sure to use enough Wen in both first and second cleanses. My hair is to my shoulder blades and medium texture. I do not color. I have to use three pumps from a gallon or it will not cream up. From a 32, I use at least six pumps THREE times for both cleanses. I guess that would be 18 pumps per cleanse. I rake and comb it through. I found it makes a difference. My hair comes out amazing. What shine and body. I tried Tweak'd and it did win some things in the customer choice awards, I believe. It's a good product but I found that it stays in the hair and is not needed. I prefer to cleanse every day. I sweat at night, always did since I was a kid so I must cleanse in the morning. My hair has a natural wave to it and that can be awful in steady humidity. I see yours is straight. I'll tell ya a secret.....lol!!! Anyway, I tried this product called "Color Wow" and it's okay but Wen is still my one and only.....

Re: Need Ideas

x Hedge — Sat, 07 Nov 2020 16:45:59 GMT

Sorry @Puppymom1 , It's been nagging me that you have some "yucky" days.

99.9% of the time yucky results means not enough WEN, not enough water, or not enough of both.

So I re-read your posts.

From your first post:

I have short hair and it is poker straight. I am using 3-4 pumps of TT or WWB on the first cleanse and 2 pumps each of 613 and BSI on the second.

From your second post:

My hair is about 2 inches below my ears. I am using about 4 pumps for each cleanse.

Guess I was picturing your straight "short hair" as meaning a short pixie cut.

Your hair is a lot longer than what I imagined from the first post.

Also, I don't count pumps any more, I didn't really register what that amount looks like. So I just counted out your 4 pumps from a quart bottle to see it.

It's pretty skimpy. If you add 1 or 2 more pumps you'll have your first "golf ball" sized amount. I think your yucky hair comes from being stingy with the product.

You'll need a healthy "golf ball" of WEN for each cleanse, total.

The Tweaked shampoo I checked contains Disodium Laureth Sulfosuccinate. That's a detergent. Detergents essentially start to de-grease on contact. Even "gentle" detergents strip the scalp and hair.

WEN contains no detergents, but it's ingredients can completely clean scalp and hair without stripping. How?

Because they work differently (apples to oranges) you have to use enough product & water to do the job, and appreciate that while WEN ingredients can break up and lift oils, grease, and soil, they do it more slowly than detergents.

Re: Need Ideas

quadmimi — Sat, 07 Nov 2020 19:10:17 GMT

@x Hedge wrote:
Sorry @Puppymom1 , It's been nagging me that you have some "yucky" days.
99.9% of the time yucky results means not enough WEN, not enough water, or not enough of both.
So I re-read your posts.

From your first post:
I have short hair and it is poker straight. I am using 3-4 pumps of TT or WWB on the first cleanse and 2 pumps each of 613 and BSI on the second.

From your second post:
My hair is about 2 inches below my ears. I am using about 4 pumps for each cleanse.

Guess I was picturing your straight "short hair" as meaning a short pixie cut.
Your hair is a lot longer than what I imagined from the first post.

Also, I don't count pumps any more, I didn't really register what that amount looks like. So I just counted out your 4 pumps from a quart bottle to see it.

It's pretty skimpy. If you add 1 or 2 more pumps you'll have your first "golf ball" sized amount. I think your yucky hair comes from being stingy with the product.

You'll need a healthy "golf ball" of WEN for each cleanse, total.

The Tweaked shampoo I checked contains Disodium Laureth Sulfosuccinate. That's a detergent. Detergents essentially start to de-grease on contact. Even "gentle" detergents strip the scalp and hair.
WEN contains no detergents, but it's ingredients can completely clean scalp and hair without stripping. How?

Because they work differently (apples to oranges) you have to use enough product & water to do the job, and appreciate that while WEN ingredients can break up and lift oils, grease, and soil, they do it more slowly than detergents.

@x Hedge

Your whipped Wen idea is all I have ever needed..It was a game changer for my fine hair...

Re: Need Ideas

77yangya — Sat, 07 Nov 2020 19:14:09 GMT

Because of your thread, I read a lot of great ideas! I think it was Sandgirl, not sure, that once posted that her hair took too long to dry and I noticed mine did too. This thread kind of brought that back to my mind. I mean it would take hours to be 100% dry, so.....I started thinking about everything that was posted here and thought well, I don't color treat, I don't flat iron nor use curl wand, only blow dryer on warm and cool and I think my hair is OVER hydrated. Today in the shower I only used my cleansing conditioner, cleanse, rinse and repeat but added back in only one pump of styling creme and my hair dried much faster and it was less weighted down. I think most people's problem is dry hair but I think it can go the other way too so I'm gonna stay like this for a while and if it becomes a bit too dry I can always go back to adding cleansing conditoner and mousse also. One poster said that the mousse provides moisture too and that never occured to me but it's true. Anyway, thank you for the lovely thread and everyone that posted. Not only was I enlightened but laughed and was uplifted too.

Re: Need Ideas

x Hedge — Sat, 07 Nov 2020 22:00:43 GMT

@quadmimi wrote:
@
@x Hedge

Your whipped Wen idea is all I have ever needed..It was a game changer for my fine hair...

😁 Well, You know I can't spread it across my scalp and down my hair unless it's whipped first, and my hair's long and coarse. Glad it works for you too @quadmimi .

Re: Need Ideas

Hair Today Gone Tomorrow — Wed, 11 Nov 2020 02:43:57 GMT

@ANewHue wrote:
Welcome. Well you did say your hair is short but you didn’t say whether it was thin or thick. I think the number of pumps you are using could be a factor, remember more Wen is better than not enough. Just make sure you rinse really well between cleanses. Another issue could be the 613 / BSI combo. I have fine hair and although I adore 613 using it incorporated in my second cleanse every time was not good for me. It gave me flyaways and my hair was a pouf. It was too much protein. So I would try skipping it to ever other cleanse and see what happens. Good luck! There is a learning curve , you’ll find what works best for your hair.

Good info here! No matter what size bottle of WEN, ANewHue is correct. I'd suggest trying just TT, for the first cleanse. If it's a 32 oz bottle, use 10 to 12 pumps. Rinse, repeat with with TT and rinse, rinse, rinse. As mentioned, 613 has more protein, and Bella Spirit has no menthol. Both are absolutely great formulas and you can incorporate them later. I have used nothing but WEN for over 21 years. I told Chaz he called it WEN because 'I'll quit using shampoo WEN pigs fly'. I couldn't get it right. I thought..... I wasn't using enough, didn't rinse enough, and felt I wasn't getting 'clean'. I promised to give it 30 days, no matter what. It didn't take nearly that long

This is my hair 21 plus years later. Every day. Don't give up. I'm so happy I didn't.

Good luck!!!!!

Re: Need Ideas

quadmimi — Wed, 11 Nov 2020 12:33:37 GMT

@Hair Today Gone Tomorrow wrote:
@ANewHue wrote:
Welcome. Well you did say your hair is short but you didn’t say whether it was thin or thick. I think the number of pumps you are using could be a factor, remember more Wen is better than not enough. Just make sure you rinse really well between cleanses. Another issue could be the 613 / BSI combo. I have fine hair and although I adore 613 using it incorporated in my second cleanse every time was not good for me. It gave me flyaways and my hair was a pouf. It was too much protein. So I would try skipping it to ever other cleanse and see what happens. Good luck! There is a learning curve , you’ll find what works best for your hair.
Good info here! No matter what size bottle of WEN, ANewHue is correct. I'd suggest trying just TT, for the first cleanse. If it's a 32 oz bottle, use 10 to 12 pumps. Rinse, repeat with with TT and rinse, rinse, rinse. As mentioned, 613 has more protein, and Bella Spirit has no menthol. Both are absolutely great formulas and you can incorporate them later. I have used nothing but WEN for over 21 years. I told Chaz he called it WEN because 'I'll quit using shampoo WEN pigs fly'. I couldn't get it right. I thought..... I wasn't using enough, didn't rinse enough, and felt I wasn't getting 'clean'. I promised to give it 30 days, no matter what. It didn't take nearly that long

This is my hair 21 plus years later. Every day. Don't give up. I'm so happy I didn't.
Good luck!!!!!

@Hair Today Gone Tomorrow

Bella Spirit has no menthol? How did I miss that, I use the Indigo everyday, ( a bit mixed in my mix-up)...I love it! See you just keep reading the Wen boards & you pick up many things...Your hair is just beautiful!