topic Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash? in Community Chat

Nothing about Stillwater crash?

hckynutjohn — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 08:43:31 GMT

I can't believe nobody has started a thread about the travesty/death and 40+ people critically and seriously injured when a car ran through the crowd during the parade in Stillwater.

Hear a lot when people are killed and maimed by another means, but about this? The silence is deafening.

Have a lot more to say but not until I hear something from those that like to talk about mentally disturbed people being able to get a license for one of our rights, but not a peep about checks for the same type of people when it comes to driving.

NOTE: I am making no comments on the guilt or what caused this woman to drive into this crowd of so many people. What I did hear is her attorney say she has a mental illness. But?? She still had a license to drive, I think! Hey! If this stays on point and everyone plays nice, maybe this thread will stay up for awhile.

hckynut(john)

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

kick — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 09:40:19 GMT

This is such a tragedy. I cannot imagine. The cause just doesn't fit the agenda of so many posters here.

My prayers go out to the victims and their loved ones.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

MaggieMack — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 11:30:32 GMT

Completely senseless tragedy. Not only is she being tagged with mentally ill, she was apparently driving drunk. Maybe we need to go back to Prohibition to prevent these incidents in the future?

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

millieshops — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 12:09:56 GMT

No matter the weapon, mental illness will always exacerbate the dangers. Add alcohol or some other drug and up the ante.

On that issue, I have no idea about the stats involved. I do know that getting too concentrated on mass killings tends to make us as a society ignore the much greater issue of the drip, drip, drip of daily deaths, many of which don't make headlines beyond their own neighborhoods.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

missy1 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 12:10:55 GMT

So sad.

I want to hear the toxicology reports.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

Puzzle Piece — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 12:41:35 GMT

@hckynutjohn Whenever a tragedy of this sort is posted, it is taken down by the Moderators or someone complains due to the nature of the subject.

It was a horribly incident. I think I heard that both mental issues and alcohol may have been involved.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

qualitygal — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 12:45:37 GMT

@Puzzle Piece is right. I have to agree with her. This upset me yesterday, someone does have to be responsible for this. Will wait to see how it turns out.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

LTT1 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 13:03:39 GMT

@hckynutjohn@qualitygal@Puzzle Piece@missy1@millieshops

I saw the report and can't remember seeing the dad actually saying she was mentally ill, but don't remember if I saw him saying it.

Really, I have been wondering about "mental illness" not being treated for quite some time. My own mind screamed about it when teaching ED (emotionally disturbed) students... after all, teachers are not trained psychiatrists. And yet, we have people with extreme mental issues left un-treated in the classroom.

Now, ever since the tragedy at Columbine (when I first thought this) it has become public.

We in our cities, towns and homes, cannot be responsible for their actions. Something needs to be done, IMO.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

silkyk — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 13:24:17 GMT

@missy1 wrote:

So sad.

I want to hear the toxicology reports.

Me too. I think a lot of these horrible incidents are do to prescribed drugs that are given FOR mental conditions. Many of these mood/mind altering drugs have violent side effects that are vastly underestimated and unreported.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

Desertdi — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 13:58:23 GMT

How would the DMV go about giving mental competency tests to millions of people? It could also bring about civil rights questions..........

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

151949 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 14:00:48 GMT

Another example of this country falling far short in treating our mentally ill. Sadly , lately, we are seeing more and more and more that people want to take others with them when they decide to attempt to kill themselves. When are the powers that be goung to see that we need to be more aggressive in treating people with mental illnesses ? Do we need to go back to locking people up in "institutions" - I hope not - but what is being done right now is certainly not working and is putting the general public at risk.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

LTT1 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 14:09:36 GMT

@hckynutjohn@151949@Desertdi@silkyk@qualitygal

My first question in the Columbine tragedy was "didn't his parents know that he was building a pipe bomb at home?"

So rather than testing everyone for mental illness, shouldn't we be asking the "responsible party" more questions in order for people to realize that if the child is a minor, the parents will be held accountable?

It seems like we wait until AFTER the fact, then ask questions, do TV shows on TRAGEDIES, etc.

People need to feel that if they report to the authorities, the authorities will actively DO something... just my thoughts...

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

June222 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 14:14:12 GMT

Waiting test results....mentally ill....drugs....

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

Sandyx3 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:25:45 GMT

@151949 wrote:
Another example of this country falling far short in treating our mentally ill. Sadly , lately, we are seeing more and more and more that people want to take others with them when they decide to attempt to kill themselves. When are the powers that be goung to see that we need to be more aggressive in treating people with mental illnesses ? Do we need to go back to locking people up in "institutions" - I hope not - but what is being done right now is certainly not working and is putting the general public at risk.

@usa Today article from 2013; Liz Szabo wrote:

"States have crafted their civil commitment laws to protect civil liberties, in reaction to abusive situations in the past, says Liza Gold, a forensic psychiatrist at the Georgetown University School of Medicine in Washington. Today, state civil commitment laws can make it difficult or impossible to hospitalize adults involuntarily, even when their families or caregivers feel threatened and patients appear extremely sick, says Dewey Cornell, director of the Virginia Youth Violence Project.

Now, Gold says, the pendulum has swung "too far," because the law doesn't allow patients to be protected from themselves.

"Our civil commitment laws are broken," Cornell says. "They are designed to protect individuals from being held against their will. But they have gone too far. They no longer protect society. We've had many cases where people who should have been hospitalized have been allowed to languish and they deteriorate into a violent act."

"Mental health laws need to be revisited on a state-by-state basis in a way that considers both civil liberties and the value of human life," Gold says.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

chrystaltree — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:27:26 GMT

Well, if you started a thread so you could NOT talk about it. Why the heck should we do the talking for you.....lol

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

chrystaltree — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:36:01 GMT

@151949 wrote:
Another example of this country falling far short in treating our mentally ill. Sadly , lately, we are seeing more and more and more that people want to take others with them when they decide to attempt to kill themselves. When are the powers that be goung to see that we need to be more aggressive in treating people with mental illnesses ? Do we need to go back to locking people up in "institutions" - I hope not - but what is being done right now is certainly not working and is putting the general public at risk.

Huh? We have no Mental Health Police in this country. There are no "powers" charged with spying on the population, snooping into medical records and then rounding people up and putting them in mental institutions. Is that what you are suggesting? Do you really want that? There is also no epidemic of people committing suicide and taking a other with them. It rarely happens, it's not a daily occurrence. Sure there are a lot of mentally ill people, depressed people, hopeless people in this country but the vast majority of them do no harm to anyone other than themselves and since we live in free country; getting help or treatment is their CHOICE. I think most of us would like it if treatment was readily available for anyone seeking it. But treatment, therapy, medication is not FREE. Someone would have pay and we all know that the public, at large, would not accept the idea of funding such programs if the money comes from tax revenues. As for the Stillwater incident. Who said anything about her having a mental illness? That hasn't been determined yet. Yes, her family would like that to be the case. But it's also quite possible, even likely that she was under the influence of some drug. We just don't know yet.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

Goldengate8361 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:43:31 GMT

So sad.....for everyone involved.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

mstyrion 1 — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:44:42 GMT

Indeed, this was a tragedy,but it should not be used as a transparent attempt to link this tragedy to gun violence and the need for reasonable gun control.

We don't yet know what motivated this young woman to do what she did. Mental illness may play a part, but I don't think anyone believes that all people with mental illness should be prohibited from driving.

I recall a case several years ago where an elderly person lost control of a car in a crowd in San Diego. Many people were killed and hurt. Should we prohibit all old people from driving too?

In my opinion, there are vast differences in driving regulations and regulations that should be put in place for responsible gun ownership.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

chickenbutt — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:51:18 GMT

chrystaltree wrote:
Well, if you started a thread so you could NOT talk about it. Why the heck should we do the talking for you.....lol

It seems to me that the OP started the thread for the express purpose of baiting. It couldn't just be left at discussing the incident. It had to become a jab on others.

Re: Nothing about Stillwater crash?

tansy — Tue, 27 Oct 2015 15:51:47 GMT

@millieshops wrote:
No matter the weapon, mental illness will always exacerbate the dangers. Add alcohol or some other drug and up the ante.

On that issue, I have no idea about the stats involved. I do know that getting too concentrated on mass killings tends to make us as a society ignore the much greater issue of the drip, drip, drip of daily deaths, many of which don't make headlines beyond their own neighborhoods.

***

You make excellent points, @millieshops, especially about the drip, drip, drip of daily deaths.