topic Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS in Community Chat

HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Oznell — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 18:21:30 GMT

Rather than the book section this time, decided to post this here since this biography involves history and social observations as much as literary concerns.

Looking at Ernest Hemingway through the lens of his major loves-- Agnes von Kurowsky, the ultimately rejecting nurse who was the inspiration for "Catherine Barkley" in "A Farewell to Arms"; and wives Hadley Richardson, Pauline Pfeiffer, Martha Gellhorn, and Mary Walsh.

We get so much more than just his romantic relationships in this. The way he was shaped by his upbringing in suburban Chicago, and extreme "roughing it" during formative childhood summers in wild northern Michigan:

The familiar turf of his complex relationship with his parents, Clarence, a successful physician, and Grace, a former opera singer is well-known.

The adult Hemingway was known to be an unsettling combination of sensitivity, and insecurity combined with intermittent cruelty in relationships. His forceful mother had dressed him as a girl in childhood, causing much anguish; his father struggled with overwhelming depression and committed suicide, foreshadowing Ernest's later depression and suicide...

All of the women with whom he had intense relationships are fascinating in their own right. Hemingway idealized his first wife, Hadley, both in real life, and in his unforgettable memoir of their Paris days, "A Moveable Feast".

In his eyes, she was the lost "good person", the one he forsook for others, as literary fame and glittering temptations overtook him... She has always seemed so sympathetic-- and was indeed remarkable, serene and loving, an anchor to the volatile Hemingway's brilliant but unreliable temperament..

Actress Mariel Hemingway, his granddaughter, gives a very revealing foreword to the book, making it another must-read for all fans of this tortured, enigmatic writer.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

nwbabs — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 18:46:37 GMT

Thanks for posting this information @Oznell this look like a read of interest. Added it to my Libby list to be notified when the library obtains. Cheers and Happy Reading All!

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Oznell — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 18:49:56 GMT

Great, @nwbabs !

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Oznell — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 19:04:22 GMT

Hemingway's wives in order:

The third one over, Martha Gellhorn, was considered one of the greatest of war correspondents herself.

And not to be left out, his youthful love that he didn't get to marry, Agnes von Kurowsky. She was an American nurse who treated him for his First World War war wounds in Milan, I think:

And injuries or no, the young Hemingway looks like he could very well have been a bit of a mischievous handful as a patient--

He was so complex. All his flaws notwithstanding, he had some highly worthy qualities in addition to his brilliance. The book outlines his absolute determination to support his mother and younger siblings after Dr. Hemingway's suicide, even when his own finances were precarious. His matter-of-fact assumption that he would have to assume responsibility, was one attractive aspect of his multi-faceted personality....

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

bmorechick — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 19:19:33 GMT

Thank you @Oznell ...I will put this on my reading list. I just love learning about new things or people.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

tansy — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 19:25:06 GMT

Such a sad family history. His granddaughter committed suicide, too

Recently I tried a few of his books again but still didn't care for them. My husband did enjoy a few though.

Nice pics.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Mz iMac — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 21:01:41 GMT

@tansy wrote:
Such a sad family history. His granddaughter committed suicide, too

@tansy Your source?

Per WiKi: Mariel Hemingway the one mentioned in this thread is alive & well.

Per WiKi: The above sister, Margaux Hemingway committed suicide.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

PinkyPetunia — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 21:38:56 GMT

If I remember correctly, a few years ago PBS had a 3 part documentary about Hemingway. Those of you having PBS Passport may have access to it. Might have been a Ken Burns work. Very interesting.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

tansy — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 22:18:11 GMT

It was a Ken Burns production, @PinkyPetunia.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

tansy — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 22:19:34 GMT

@Mz iMac wrote:
@tansy wrote:
Such a sad family history. His granddaughter committed suicide, too

@tansy Your source?

Per WiKi: Mariel Hemingway the one mentioned in this thread is alive & well.

Per WiKi: The above sister, Margaux Hemingway committed suicide.

I didn't say it was Mariel. Honestly I couldn't remember the sister's name.

@Mz iMac

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Desert Lily — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 22:37:07 GMT

I read some of his books. I wish I could say that I'm a fan. In my mind while reading, I heard his voice as drunken, superfluous utterings, and often narcissistic.

I watched the PBS Hemingway documentary, hoping to gain more respect for his writing. Unfortunately, that didn't happen.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Lakelife62 — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 22:38:45 GMT

Papa Hemingway was a genius. His writing is magnificent, though he was in mental pain and used alcohol to numb that. I often wonder if that kind of pain was the fuel for his work.

The family legacy of suicide is very sad with some pointing to an inherited condition of high metal content in the body which could have accounted for some of the symptoms both he and his father (who also committed suicide) displayed.

@tansy

just fyi- i saw your question to me earlier for a split second.

the info is available, and when looking for it, be sure to include the numbers in the "other" category. Or you can also view the totals for every person who had their hat in the ring and the list is long!

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

shoekitty — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 23:28:27 GMT

I love some of his books. I think I admire his style of writing more than some of the story lines He just wrote with words that could transport you. Such vivid images with simply words, strung together. A potpourri that made sense. He led a movement , and paved the path for many after him. He was a tortured soul who didn't know he was tortured, but everyone around him sure did , lol. It is written he was a faithless friend, cruel , husband and a lousy drunk. But he still reeled them in, as the others walked out the door. Unfortunately, he might have left the legacy of depression and addiction to his blood heirs. But, he was who is was, without any of these traits he might not have given us the most wonderful works on paper. He also left a legacy of his black cats. He is totally unique in that venture. I love reading about him. Especially his Paris years. He was a genius, with words

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Oznell — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 23:46:59 GMT

@tansy , and @Mz iMac -- Depending on who you've read, Hemingway has at least five members of his family who were confirmed suicides.

In addition to Ernest, his father and granddaughter Margaux, his brother Leicester Hemingway and sister, Ursula Hemingway, took their lives. After his father's death, sadly, Ernest said that that was probably the way that he would go.

It's ironic that he survived war, and later on, two plane crashes, only to end his own life.

The Hemingways have struggled with a bewildering variety of mental illnesses, and in addition, Ernest was an alcoholic.

Note to anyone who may have given up on reading him. Of his fiction, I've always found "The Sun Also Rises" the most immediately engaging of his novels. It's set in the post-War ( World War 1) Paris that he knew so well.

The novel follows a group of American expatriates, artists and writers, in the exciting Paris of the period. "Jake Barnes" is a writer who has been forever altered by the war, and has a doomed relationship with free spirit "Lady Brett Ashley', who flits aimlessly from man to man in their circle.

Jake adores Brett, but she is with American Robert Cohn, for whom Jake develops an abiding contempt. Lady Brett is a thinly disguised version of the real life British aristocrat, Duff, Lady Twysden, and I vaguely think that the man on whom Cohn was based, sued Hemingway or his publisher for defamation ( or something like that!)

Hemingway is on the left, and the woman in the hat is Duff. Hadley is the smiling woman in the center.

And for non-fiction, the aforementioned "A Moveable Feast" is irresistable, even for people who are not crazy about Hemingway, I think. It covers the same period and circle of famous artists-- but it is real life-- and is permeated with Hemingway's poignant regret over leaving Hadley.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Oznell — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 23:47:58 GMT

Just saw your assessment, @shoekitty -- it is spot on!

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

tansy — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 23:59:37 GMT

Interesting background, @Oznell. I didn't realize there were that many suicides in his life. I grew up with an alcoholic father who would threaten commiting suicide. He flew a P51 during WWII and that is where he began to drink heavily and met my English mother.

I don't think I will read A Moveable Feast but will mention it to my older son who likes Hemingway's books.

If you haven't been to Key West, you should.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Bookplate — Sat, 11 Jan 2025 00:14:16 GMT

In addition to his women, his wars and his writing, he also had a passion for cats, particularly the six-toed variety.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

shoekitty — Sat, 11 Jan 2025 00:19:20 GMT

A quote of hemmingways I love. It's the words. So vivid. You know what he is feeling and seeing. At least I do!

"You expected to be sad in the fall. Part of you died each year when the leaves fell from the trees and their branches were bare against the wind and the cold, wintery light. But you knew there would always be the spring, as you knew the river would flow again after it was frozen. When the cold rains kept on and killed the spring, it was as though a young person died for no reason."

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

mildoo — Sat, 11 Jan 2025 00:21:53 GMT

Ernest Hemingway was such a romantic and tragic figure in American History and in some circles is still considered America's greatest author. He grew up and grew old with so many strikes against him, most notably starting with his own mother. She not only dressed him as a girl but dressed his sister as a boy and always reminded her children that she gave up a very promising career for them. In his later life he admitted that he hated her and blamed her for his father's suicide and his own tumultuous relationships with women. And for all his talent he lied and exagerated events in his life. And he suffered several head injuries which was thought to be a major contributor to his mental illness.

I have always been fascinated with Hemingway and Ken Burns documentary is excellent. His fourth wife Mary Walsh was probably treated the worst of all and near the end of his life he called Hadley. He stilled loved her. And she made a new life for herself but I think she still loved Ernest, too.

Re: HEMINGWAY'S PASSIONS

Lakelife62 — Sat, 11 Jan 2025 00:23:37 GMT

@Desert Lily wrote:
I read some of his books. I wish I could say that I'm a fan. In my mind while reading, I heard his voice as drunken, superfluous utterings, and often narcissistic.

I watched the PBS Hemingway documentary, hoping to gain more respect for his writing. Unfortunately, that didn't happen.

Misogynistic as well. He was known to be a physical abuser.

He was a product of his time. Most would never recognize depression as a mental illness, much less seek treatment for it. The mentally ill were shunned. Left to their own devices, many find alcohol will temporarily ease the pain. The side effects are a real disaster though. While it's not an excuse for bad behavior, it's a reason.