topic Re: Strong women in Community Chat

Strong women

suzyQ3 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 18:39:02 GMT

It seems that we have differing opinions as to what constitutes a "strong" women. I have always thought that even calling a women "strong" is outdated. We don't call men "strong."

Be that as it may, my idea of a strong woman is one who is not fearful when it comes to speaking her mind, doesn't allow her gender to dictate how she lives her life, tries to be competent and independent, and makes life choices based on desire rather than fitting into a particular gender-related box.

This issue arose for me after reading a post today that indicated a preference for a strong woman who was not overly aggressive or assertive. To me, those two adjectives, when applied to women, are subtle reminders of our "place" in life: don't be too loud or forceful because it is not becoming for a woman.

That's my take. What's yours?

Re: Strong women

QVCkitty1 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 18:50:03 GMT

@suzyQ3 wrote:
It seems that we have differing opinions as to what constitutes a "strong" women. I have always thought that even calling a women "strong" is outdated. We don't call men "strong."

Be that as it may, my idea of a strong woman is one who is not fearful when it comes to speaking her mind, doesn't allow her gender to dictate how she lives her life, tries to be competent and independent, and makes life choices based on desire rather than fitting into a particular gender-related box.

This issue arose for me after reading a post today that indicated a preference for a strong woman who was not overly aggressive or assertive. To me, those two adjectives, when applied to women, are subtle reminders of our "place" in life: don't be too loud or forceful because it is not becoming for a woman.

That's my take. What's yours?

@suzyQ3 , My take is much like yours. I cringed when I read that line about being overly aggressive and assertive. That attitude is out of date and sad.

Re: Strong women

deepwaterdotter — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 18:54:01 GMT

I have heard men referred to as being "weak". In my former workplace, a male manager was replaced due to being "a weak manager".

Re: Strong women

Alison Wonderland — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 18:54:36 GMT

I agree with you.

And yes, I frequently see women being called bossy or another B-word when they're assertive, something seen as a good quality in men but a bad quality in women.

I recently heard an episode of On the Media on NPR, where they had several guests speaking on interesting issues that affected women. One was about algorithms and how they're usually written by or geared to prefer attributes we usually see as belonging to white men, which can have a detrimental effect on women and people of color. That guest was Cathy O'Neil, mathematician and author of Weapons of Math Destruction.

Another story was about radio and the way it was set up over 100 years ago. The frequencies used were those that worked best for the deeper voices of men and which made women sound tinny, distorted, and - of course - shrill.

It was fascinating. The On the Media episode is called The Disagreement is the Point. The audio and transcripts are available at the WYNC Studios site. I would link here, but the lead story was about politics, so I can't.

Re: Strong women

Puppy Lips — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:03:00 GMT

@suzyQ3 wrote:
It seems that we have differing opinions as to what constitutes a "strong" women. I have always thought that even calling a women "strong" is outdated. We don't call men "strong."

Be that as it may, my idea of a strong woman is one who is not fearful when it comes to speaking her mind, doesn't allow her gender to dictate how she lives her life, tries to be competent and independent, and makes life choices based on desire rather than fitting into a particular gender-related box.

This issue arose for me after reading a post today that indicated a preference for a strong woman who was not overly aggressive or assertive. To me, those two adjectives, when applied to women, are subtle reminders of our "place" in life: don't be too loud or forceful because it is not becoming for a woman.

That's my take. What's yours?

@suzyQ3 I agree with on all your points, and I also do not like the term "strong woman." As far as overly aggressive or assertive, I don't like those characteristics in a woman OR a man. But I hope that society will slowly get to the point that in the work place, all are treated equal no matter what body parts you were born with (or changed.)

Re: Strong women

beckyb1012 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:04:11 GMT

One of the best compliments I ever received was from my ex husband after our divorce in 1999. He told a mutual friend of ours who passed his comment on to me that "the next time I marry the woman will NOT be a strong independent woman." I did not see the other thread but that is just so wrong if that is what that poster believes.

Re: Strong women

newname0 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:07:36 GMT

Who do you have in mind when you say this? I can think of one woman:

or if you like:

Re: Strong women

GingerPeach — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:09:33 GMT

I admire strength in people. I tend to equate strength, in part, with getting things done as well as having what used to be called "personal power," which is not control over others but "control," if you will, over oneself.

And like you, @suzyQ3 , I think putting limits on the amount or kind of strength is not appropriate, particularly when it comes to an attempt to keep someone in a place someone else has defined for them. At least, I hope I'm not putting words in your mouth.

We seem to still be in a place in history during which women are playing catch-up, making it even more egregious to place limits on how women are "supposed" to behave.

Re: Strong women

qualitygal — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:16:13 GMT

I'd say, a strong woman weathers the storms of life with grace, dignity, and yet still does no harm by her mouth. What she says. A strong woman doesn't have a bad mouth. She can be honest, without taking anyone out.

Re: Strong women

blackhole99 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:20:29 GMT

A strong woman to me is someone who is confident enough in herself, the skills she brings to the work place and her own moral compass, not to be the victim. IMO there is nothing wrong with the word strong, it's just a word and men are stronger physically than most women and God knows they don't think the same way most women do. Women have been working around that fact forever and I don't see it changing any time soon. I think we need to raise our sons to be kind and gentle and not combative from the cradle.

Re: Strong women

Ruby Laine — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:24:53 GMT

My mom was one of the kindest, gentlest people I've known. She also had a backbone of steel. She knew when to speak her mind (without malice) and when to hold her tongue. She was very comfortable in her own skin.

Hard to believe, but I never heard her raise her voice. When she got angry at her kids, her voice dropped and we had to strain to hear her! If a conversation about another person became spiteful, she would come up with something positive to say about him or her, or leave the conversation.

She could disagree with people quietly and with a smile. They would think they had someone how just received a compliment. I would ask many times how she could be so untouched by those who could never see two sides. She said it took all kinds of people to make a world and what a boring place it would be if we were all alike. She led by example and I wish I were more like her.

Re: Strong women

sunshine45 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:25:33 GMT

i agree with what you stated @suzyQ3 , but i dont mind the term "strong woman." i do use the terms "strong man," "strong person," "strong _____ ."

would love to post some quotes, but they would probably be deemed political.

Re: Strong women

bathina — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:26:03 GMT

I also winced when I read that post. No one insists that men be non agressive or non assertive. Have to agree that "overly" should apply to men and women. As far as doing no harm "with her mouth". Whaaat? We wouldn't be able to vote if women werent willing to stand up to the status quo. To me, a strong woman is someone who speaks truth to power, even when her voice shakes.

Re: Strong women

qualitygal — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:26:43 GMT

@Ruby Laine You totally understood, for I had described my mother too.

Re: Strong women

Nonametoday — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:27:33 GMT

Strong women are assertive but never aggressive. Aggressiveness expresses fear and insecurity of one's opinions.

Re: Strong women

Ruby Laine — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:30:17 GMT

@qualitygal, our moms sound a lot alike! She and my dad raised amazing sons, too. My brothers are the best.

Re: Strong women

Katcat1 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:31:46 GMT

A strong woman is a woman that can be independent and take care of herself.

Re: Strong women

suzyQ3 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:36:21 GMT

@Nonametoday wrote:
Strong women are assertive but never aggressive. Aggressiveness expresses fear and insecurity of one's opinions.

@Nonametoday, from Merriam-Webster:

Synonyms & Antonyms of aggressiveness

1 readiness to engage in daring or difficult activity

because of the mayor's aggressiveness in tackling problems, there have been significant changes for the better

Synonyms for aggressiveness

Re: Strong women

suzyQ3 — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:45:51 GMT

@qualitygal wrote:
I'd say, a strong woman weathers the storms of life with grace, dignity, and yet still does no harm by her mouth. What she says. A strong woman doesn't have a bad mouth. She can be honest, without taking anyone out.

I agree that that is the optimal way, @qualitygal, as long as it also applies to men.

Grace, dignity, and no harm by her mouth is perhaps a good way to live your life on a daily basis. I have to say, though, that sometimes circumstances cry out for more, regardless of gender.

Re: Strong women

LoveMyBaby — Wed, 04 Dec 2019 19:49:43 GMT

@suzyQ3

Amen to that.