topic Re: Stanford expells student in Community Chat

Stanford expells student

songbird — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 20:20:21 GMT

Stanford, along with Cal Tech, the cream of the crop of universities in California has expelled a student for falsifying background and linked to $500,000 donation.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/08/us/college-admission-stanford/index.html

Stanford is the best anyone can do outside of Ivy League. Famous for very difficult standards on SAT. Just to graduate Masters from their business school will cost you six figures. Columbia is considered one of the most expensive of schools. Stanford is pretty close.

Excellent speaker. The guest was talking about the wide variety of excellent schools out there that are not publicized enough. My school is outstanding in Biochemistry for example. You don't have to expire to an out of reach Ivy League school, when you so many other options.

Re: Stanford expells student

cherry — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 20:18:50 GMT

Maybe we are becoming more principled about this sort of thing. We should make education available to everyone on a more equitable footing

Perhaps not free ,but ,more affordable ,and fairer to all

When I think of fine minds languishing, for lack of funds, and people buying their way in, that don't care a hoot, about education, it makes me mad, and queasy

Re: Stanford expells student

songbird — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 20:33:44 GMT

@cherry wrote:
Maybe we are becoming more principled about this sort of thing. We should make education available to everyone on a more equitable footing

Perhaps not free ,but ,more affordable ,and fairer to all

When I think of fine minds languishing, for lack of funds, and people buying their way in, that don't care a hoot, about education, it makes me mad, and queasy

That problem is in private schools. They can only live on endowments. Corruption is easy to creep in with that system. That is nothing new. There are just as good public universities that depend on government money.

You really can't have free universities system. It will cheapen the intent of universities. To get a well paying job that opens your mind to many things along the way to graduating. Not only do you get a good paying job, but you are educated in many ways. Not every person should go to college. It's not for everybody. You have community colleges now. It's low cost alternative. You then can easily transfer to a university the last two years. Even though my father was a Mathematics professor at a very good school, it did not give me a free ticket to get in. You have to qualify just like everyone else.

Re: Stanford expells student

cherry — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 20:25:35 GMT

The rich will always find loopholes ,I guess. I am happy that people are actually angry about this sort of thing, and I hope people with a conscience ,will someday figure out a way, to make this a fairer system

Re: Stanford expells student

Mz iMac — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 20:34:11 GMT

"The student is not named in the statement or in court documents."

"The money was funneled from wealthy parents"

The parents names should be blasted all over national news feeds to discourage "future" scams. Otherwise, these scams will continue till the end of time. I seriously doubt the recent events will stop this type of thing. Been going on since like "forever."

You might as well add them to the "oldest profession in the world" list.

Re: Stanford expells student

Annabellethecat66 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 21:05:08 GMT

My oldest daughter and son-in-law graduated from University of Va with a Masters degree from Georgetown University. It was extremely expensive.

I'm sorry but I often think with many of these colleges you are buying the fact that you went to one of these universities.

In Virginia, we have a lot of excellent colleges. Among them is George Mason University in Fairfax, Virginia. There are a lot of famous people who've been in government that teach there. Yet you never hear much about that college.

There are so many excellent colleges in the United States. I've always thought it didn't make sense the way Yale and some of the other colleges are so famous.

I remember saying to my husband at the time my daughter was going to Georgetown, "They told (my daughter) if she'd gone to George Mason University or James Madison University, she wouldn't have gotten into the Master's program at Georgetown". My late husband laughed and said, "Humph! I think if you have the money and decent grades, you can go anywhere".

Boy was he right! That's not to take away from people like my daughter who worked her fanny off. The kind of Masters she wanted was specifically at Georgetown.

In my opinion, the worst thing these people did was when they declared on their taxes they were donating money to a charity. That's not to say all of the other crimes weren't bad, but reading (in quotes) from People Magazine some of the comments made by these people about "Ha! Ha! Donating to charity". That makes me sick.

Re: Stanford expells student

lovesrecess — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 21:14:20 GMT

Ivy League schools may have more prestige... but there is no guarantee you will get a better education there. The quality of your college education depends greatly on how much time and effort the student is willing to put forth. Two of my DDs were recruited by ivy league schools...we took the tours, etc. neither one wanted to attend the schools. There was too much political ideology attached to every person we met at both schools....a big turn-off for both of my girls...they are 5 years in age difference and nothing had changed when I went with the younger DD to visit the same school....there are hundreds of great schools out there....attending one only for the parent’s bragging-rights is not the way to go....as Huffman and Loughlin have discovered.

Re: Stanford expells student

blackhole99 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 21:24:00 GMT

Rich people go to these expensive, exclusive universities as a right of passage. I don't have a problem with that as long as it doesn't effect everyone else. No,not everyone is college material, but everyone should be able to access college and a good education in general,just to level the playing field some.Just about everything that has to do with social equality is disappearing in this country, it's looking like every man for himself. Hopefully the young people will see the hand writing on the wall and step up. By the way, just because you go to an ivy league college doesn't mean you will get the job and make the salary of your dreams, the rich hire the rich first, then it's every one else, maybe.

Re: Stanford expells student

PINKdogWOOD — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 21:40:10 GMT

Many many people cannot even afford their kids' college educations. In this whole mess with rich people literally buying their kids' into colleges is disgusting in my opinion. What's worse, some of these rich kids did not even know what their parents did. Then there are other kids who did know.

All of these rich folks who did this need to own up, show up in the court system and take the consequences and if this means jail time AND A LOT OF IT need to pay this price of being ignorant and stupid.

Re: Stanford expells student

suzyQ3 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:32:57 GMT

@songbird wrote:
@cherry wrote:
Maybe we are becoming more principled about this sort of thing. We should make education available to everyone on a more equitable footing

Perhaps not free ,but ,more affordable ,and fairer to all

When I think of fine minds languishing, for lack of funds, and people buying their way in, that don't care a hoot, about education, it makes me mad, and queasy
That problem is in private schools. They can only live on endowments. Corruption is easy to creep in with that system. That is nothing new. There are just as good public universities that depend on government money.

You really can't have free universities system. It will cheapen the intent of universities. To get a well paying job that opens your mind to many things along the way to graduating. Not only do you get a good paying job, but you are educated in many ways. Not every person should go to college. It's not for everybody. You have community colleges now. It's low cost alternative. You then can easily transfer to a university the last two years. Even though my father was a Mathematics professor at a very good school, it did not give me a free ticket to get in. You have to qualify just like everyone else.

Not if they kept the same requirements for admission, @songbird

I wish at least that well-qualified candidates who have no financial means could be accommodated with a financial package that would cover their expenses. A shocking number of college students are homeless and hungry on a regular basis.

Re: Stanford expells student

Annabellethecat66 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 21:49:38 GMT

You know, I was just thinking that not everyone wants to or can go to college (for various reasons). Yet, in this country, all we ever hear is college, college.

Buiding a house has become so complex these days, one needs to go to trade school just to learn how to become a plumber, etc.

These kids go to college and many of them flunk out after the first or second year. I saw that in my family just a few weeks ago.

Then people graduate and they aren't really trained to do anything specific....but (and there's a lot of money in that word but) they are so in debt many of them will never get out of that debt.

It's interesting that I've heard a few people saying lately that colleges need to "put some skin in this game". That means colleges need to buck up and do more to help these kids either pay that enormous tuition or if they don't make it, do more to get behind him academically.

If you think about it, it's a win-win for the college. It's always been a joke "He's on the 5 year plan for college" (things like that). Well, perhaps if the colleges had something to loose when these kids dropped out/flunked out, etc, they'd take more of an interest in the kid, etc.

I'm not an 'academic'. I don't know the answers. But what I do know is something must be done because these people are starting out their lives with enormous debt.

Just yesterday I was talking to my oldest daughter about the fact that she and her husband started their married life with absolutely no college debt. My husband and I paid for all of it. My son-in-law went ROTC at UVA (that's why he went there). He could have gone to Harvard, etc. but he wanted to go ROTC. As it turns out his parents gave him the money they'd saved for him to go to college when he graduated. He wanted to do it on his own. That's the kind of man he is. Not all kids have that option.

This is a great country. But there are still so many 'things' that need to be worked out...this is just one of them.

My niece is a Professor at Stanford University. I'd love to talk to her and hear her take on all of this.

Re: Stanford expells student

cherry — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 21:58:06 GMT

@Annabellethecat66 My son has his master's in teaching. He says college isn't for everyone' and that people need to learn trades ,again

I have read there is a shortage of welders, and the pay is really good. That is true in many, fields

My husband was a skilled tradesman and he was apprenticed for 8 years. Then he got a journeyman's card .

We were watching a program about bespoke tailoring ,and I told my husband, you could do that job so easily ,with your training, of course ,he would have had to learn sewing skills, but making a pattern ,to fit a shape, is really an art form, and also a feat of engineering . One that my husband understands well.

The world is filled with possibilities, but ,it seems kids want to be rock stars, or athletes, and so few make it to the top, even if they are a huge talent.

Re: Stanford expells student

lovesrecess — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:07:49 GMT

No one who doesn’t want to be in college should be there. Period. If there is “free” college for everyone, there will be some who hide out in college to avoid getting a job....it has been happening for years with Pell grants and other government subsidies. No degree is worth graduating with six-figures debt. Pay as you go, go to a trade school, or work your tail off and get a scholarship.

The parents have not thought about the impact of this on their own kids. They are the true victims if they were not aware of their parent’s crimes....and what school is going to admit them now? No college wants to have them enrolled at their school for fear they will be accused of taking bribes....so many consequences these celebrity and wealthy parents never thought about...just too used to buying their way through anything.

Re: Stanford expells student

jeanlake — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:27:11 GMT

Having worked in higher education for 30 years, I agree state universities and community colleges should continue to offer trades, whether in certificates or various degrees. A world full of liberal arts students isn't exactly what a society needs. And prestige institutions produce a lot of liberal arts undergrads.

The community college I work at has various certs/degrees in computer science, fire science, police science, cosmetology, paramedic program, nursing, dental hygenist, interior design, drafting, graphic design, baking and chef programs, sustainability & agriculture, child development, and even a three year train conductor program requiring trig and physics. I know I left out some programs. Although many of our students transfer on to bachelor programs, career ready programs are well attended and I'm thrilled our campus is preparing students to go out into the world with skills.

Wish I had some pixie dust to toss around. Imagine how free community college and state university tuition would be an asset to our society if students could begin careers without debilitating debt. Some college students may be 30 - 50 years old before they can afford to buy homes, drive reliable vehicles or take nice vacations.

Yes -- maintaining academic success, student volunteerism or civic duty and increased taxes would be needed for free tuition. I'm thankful our veterans catch a break on college tuition.

Re: Stanford expells student

cherry — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:34:46 GMT

My son is a ve,t and he went to school on the GI bill. They have to pay for this now. At one time they didn't

It was a big chunk of change out of every pay , for a while..Many of the guys didn't want to have the money taken from them ,and didn't sign up

My son teaches all over the world, and chose to get his masters online ,from the school that taught him while he was in the Navy. They flew the instructors to the base to teach the men. It is a school in Illinois, and they were wonderful instructors

Re: Stanford expells student

Trinity11 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 23:03:53 GMT

n/m

Re: Stanford expells student

Annabellethecat66 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:43:28 GMT

@cherry You and your husband are so right. My late husband had a masters degree (school at night, VA benefits, etc). He started a computer business back in the very early 80's. It got very big and he was bored so he sold it back to his partner. He started various other small businesses but his favorite was building and fixing up houses He loved it.

He used to complain that he couldn't find people qualified to do the work.

So, with that in mind when he died suddenly, I set up a scholarship in his name at a high school that was named after his family. I thought he'd really like it.

So, after my son-in-law did all of the work (lots of paperwork,etc) of setting everything up, we went to the high school and here was my requirements, it had to be for someone (male or female) who wanted to learn a trade (i.e. plumbing, heating/air conditioning, etc). They only needed to have a solid C average (or above) when they graduated high school. It had to be an accredited trade school. (There were a few other minor things, nothing that would prevent a serious student from earning it). It was enough money to pay for (what was at the time) the entire tuition.

Do you know the school turned it down? They said it had to be for an academic college. There were other things, but that was the jest of it right there.

We were floored! Now this was back around 2005-2006 so I hope things have changed at this school. Ironically, this is a high school in an area where there is a lot of families who would want to learn a trade and maybe NOT go to college. It's in Virginia.

I watch (and DVR) all of the "This Old House" shows, etc. I know first hand all of the problems they are very honest about trying to find qualified people to build and repair homes, offices, etc.

In fact, last season the entire seaso showed 3 kids who'd graduated high school (some had college) but wanted to work with their hands. They had them on the show and they learned all of the variations and knowledge needed to build a house these days.

There are so many amazing innovations going into houses today. One needs to be up on the latest and continue to go to school in order to work on these appliances, heaters, etc.

Even car repair needs qualified people working on them. They're all about computers, etc. these days.

You sound like a sharp cookie. You and your husband. Sometimes I get frustrated hearing about people boo hooing about assembly lines closing down. That's what happens sometimes. When that happens people need to go back to school to learn what comes next. They need to be ready to move to where the work is. No longer are people able to live in one place for the rest of their lives (if it's a small town). This is unfortunate because the towns are dying out. The best thing would be for a company to move in there, invest and teach these people new skills.

I really believe the heart of this country are those small towns. I keep hearing about them dying out. I read that Amazon could have gone anywhere. But the main reason they wanted to be in Crystal City, Va (I live near there) is because it's close to DC and the word that gives a bad taste in my mouth (lobbyists). As far as I'm concerned a lobbyist is the bane of this country....they are one of the things that's wrong with this country.

Whoops.....I've drifted off subject again. I need a little pinch to get me back on track.

Take care and I'm sorry I went on so long. I could have just said "You are very bright and it sounds like you and your husband make a good couple". That would have prevented all of my bla bla.

Re: Stanford expells student

cherry — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:50:43 GMT

That school was stupid. When I had my kitchen remodeled, we looked all over for custom cabinets

The place we chose, had a young lad that had attended my daughters school. He had taken shop class ,and his instructor was so impressed with this young guy, he got him a job ,as a apprentice in a cabinet making company

You should see the job he did on my kitchen. It could be in a Better Homes and Gardens magazine

@Annabellethecat66 that school was stupid ,and as far as I am concerned, snobs of the first order

Re: Stanford expells student

suzyQ3 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:52:08 GMT

Have some attained the American dream just on their own initiative and smarts? Of course.

But the reality is that far more people attain the American dream with countless help -- the family they "chose," the neighborhoods they've lived in, the financial situation of the family, and of course their demographics relalting to race and ethnicity.

In the vast number of cases, the self-made man who pulled himself up by his own bootstraps is a myth.

Re: Stanford expells student

Kachina624 — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 22:54:16 GMT

Funny, once I got my diploma, nobody wanted to know or cared where I went to school.