topic Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD... in Community Chat

FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

Oznell — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:05:37 GMT

Of course there are tons of resources, but one that I've started and that is so good, is noted medievalist (he taught at Princeton, N.Y.U. and Columbia), Norman Cantor's "The Last Knight-- The Twilight of the Middle Ages and the Birth of the Modern Era".

There's a reason that everyone from the New Yorker to Anne Rice recommends Cantor's books, I think. It is that he vividly creates that remote world of the Middle Ages, so that even total amateurs like me can feel it, walk around in it, and begin to dimly understand the complexities. That's his great talent.

In this one, he uses the character of John of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster (and second surviving son of King Edward III) to anchor his exploration of the teeming societies of the fourteenth century.

Cantor references Shakespeare's depiction of the real life John of Gaunt. Shakespeare attributes to Gaunt, in his play "Richard II", the famous speech about England, that includes the memorable lines "...this sceptred isle... This other Eden, demi-paradise". A pivotal figure indeed. The turbulence he experienced as a wealthy English aristocrat is shown to be felt down to the lowliest cloth workers or peasants on the European continent.

Now I'm tempted by Cantor's other works-- they all sound quite tantalizing:

"In the Wake of the Plague: The Black Death and the World it Made"

"The Civilization of the Middle Ages"

"The Sacred Chain: The History of the Jews"

"Alexander the Great: Journey to the End of the Earth"

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

spiderw — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:13:39 GMT

I love to read and have all sorts of books based on different topics and subjects. However, I too am not acquainted with these books by Cantor and have read very little about the Medieval World.

I have seen a few movies based on this subject but movies are usually not as involved or detailed as books as we know. These books sound interesting and would be a good read for those of us who aren't as familiar with the subject as we would like. Based on your post I may check into Cantor's books and find one which would interest me. I have so many books to read but am always ready to check out a new one!

Thanks for the information!

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

nomless — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:23:52 GMT

@Oznell, you might also enjoy Ian Mortimer's A Time Traveler's Guide to Medieval England.

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

GingerPeach — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:20:48 GMT

Thanks for this, @Oznell I was inspired to read some of the amazon reviews.

On a related note, it's been years since I've read Ken Follett's Pillars of the Earth, but if you have read both and since it seems they cover roughly the same period, do you see any likenesses in style or characters or anything else that jumps out at you?

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

maestra — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:47:27 GMT

@Oznell wrote:
Of course there are tons of resources, but one that I've started and that is so good, is noted medievalist (he taught at Princeton, N.Y.U. and Columbia), Norman Cantor's "The Last Knight-- The Twilight of the Middle Ages and the Birth of the Modern Era".

There's a reason that everyone from the New Yorker to Anne Rice recommends Cantor's books, I think. It is that he vividly creates that remote world of the Middle Ages, so that even total amateurs like me can feel it, walk around in it, and begin to dimly understand the complexities. That's his great talent.

In this one, he uses the character of John of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster (and second surviving son of King Edward III) to anchor his exploration of the teeming societies of the fourteenth century.

Cantor references Shakespeare's depiction of the real life John of Gaunt. Shakespeare attributes to Gaunt, in his play "Richard II", the famous speech about England, that includes the memorable lines "...this sceptred isle... This other Eden, demi-paradise". A pivotal figure indeed. The turbulence he experienced as a wealthy English aristocrat is shown to be felt down to the lowliest cloth workers or peasants on the European continent.

Now I'm tempted by Cantor's other works-- they all sound quite tantalizing:

"In the Wake of the Plague: The Black Death and the World it Made"

"The Civilization of the Middle Ages"

"The Sacred Chain: The History of the Jews"

"Alexander the Great: Journey to the End of the Earth"

I've read the first 2 books by N. Cantor-excellent!

Would also recommend Barbara Tichmans Life In the 14th Century-pivotal due to Black Death, society radically changed sociological strata and the emergence of the High Middle Ages.

Also very good: William Manchester's A World Lit Only By Fire.

Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet was set in 13th or 14th century Verona.

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

maestra — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:49:27 GMT

@Oznell wrote:
Of course there are tons of resources, but one that I've started and that is so good, is noted medievalist (he taught at Princeton, N.Y.U. and Columbia), Norman Cantor's "The Last Knight-- The Twilight of the Middle Ages and the Birth of the Modern Era".

There's a reason that everyone from the New Yorker to Anne Rice recommends Cantor's books, I think. It is that he vividly creates that remote world of the Middle Ages, so that even total amateurs like me can feel it, walk around in it, and begin to dimly understand the complexities. That's his great talent.

In this one, he uses the character of John of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster (and second surviving son of King Edward III) to anchor his exploration of the teeming societies of the fourteenth century.

Cantor references Shakespeare's depiction of the real life John of Gaunt. Shakespeare attributes to Gaunt, in his play "Richard II", the famous speech about England, that includes the memorable lines "...this sceptred isle... This other Eden, demi-paradise". A pivotal figure indeed. The turbulence he experienced as a wealthy English aristocrat is shown to be felt down to the lowliest cloth workers or peasants on the European continent.

Now I'm tempted by Cantor's other works-- they all sound quite tantalizing:

"In the Wake of the Plague: The Black Death and the World it Made"

"The Civilization of the Middle Ages"

"The Sacred Chain: The History of the Jews"

"Alexander the Great: Journey to the End of the Earth"

I've read the first 2 books by N. Cantor-excellent!

Would also recommend Barbara Tichmans Life In the 14th Century-pivotal due to Black Death, society radically changed sociological strata and the emergence of the High Middle Ages.

Also very good: William Manchester's A World Lit Only By Fire.

Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet was set in 13th or 14th century Verona. For my money, Franco Zefferelli (1968 film) is the best in terms of costuming/setting) Zefferelli was asked how he was able to portray so much of his work accurately from this time period and he stated that he remembered living at that time period. Fascinating.

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

Oznell — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 18:51:28 GMT

Thanks so much for your comments and the recommendations, gang!

I've not read the two you mention, @nomless and @GingerPeach, but sound good. @maestra, I have "A World Lit Only By Fire", great recommendation. Don't you love him-- he has that same scholarly, yet "popular" touch that Norman Cantor has!

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

ALRATIBA — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 19:02:07 GMT

@Oznell wrote:
Of course there are tons of resources, but one that I've started and that is so good, is noted medievalist (he taught at Princeton, N.Y.U. and Columbia), Norman Cantor's "The Last Knight-- The Twilight of the Middle Ages and the Birth of the Modern Era".

There's a reason that everyone from the New Yorker to Anne Rice recommends Cantor's books, I think. It is that he vividly creates that remote world of the Middle Ages, so that even total amateurs like me can feel it, walk around in it, and begin to dimly understand the complexities. That's his great talent.

(snip)

Now I'm tempted by Cantor's other works-- they all sound quite tantalizing:

"In the Wake of the Plague: The Black Death and the World it Made"

------------------------------------

@Oznell

When I was researching our family history ... the plague became so much more "real" ... looking through German church records where the cause of death recorded as "der Pest." Not just statistics, but real people who lived in the same villages as my ancestors.

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

Oznell — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 19:11:47 GMT

Wow, exactly, @ALRATIBA! How fascinating for you. That personal connection that seems to drive us toward history and vice versa and makes it real and living...

I got something of that feeling when I first started reading about the persecution of the Huguenots (French Protestants) in France. It hit home b/c I had vaguely heard in childhood that some of my mother's ancestors had to flee France for Ireland because they were Huguenots...

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

ALRATIBA — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 19:44:19 GMT

@Oznell wrote:
Wow, exactly, @ALRATIBA! How fascinating for you. That personal connection that seems to drive us toward history and vice versa and makes it real and living...

I got something of that feeling when I first started reading about the persecution of the Huguenots (French Protestants) in France. It hit home b/c I had vaguely heard in childhood that some of my mother's ancestors had to flee France for Ireland because they were Huguenots...

@Oznell

I've been interested in history since high school ... but when we started doing our genealogy about 40 years ago .. history became "personal" it became our story.

Now with the DNA, we are able to trace migration routes ... so it's getting much more personal and much more interesting. And ... some our DNA results have been quite surprising.

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

Drythe — Sun, 06 Jan 2019 22:23:08 GMT

@Oznell

Thanks for the information.

I have not read any of Cantor’s books, but I do know John of Gaunt. I have a a great biography of Katherine de Rouet, (Swnford - first husband) who was his long term mistress, and with whom he had many children. In their later years, their relationship was ‘regularized’ by the Pope’,they were married, and the ‘stain of bastardy’ was removed from their children by Papal Decree.

Ultimately, descendants of one of their children were part of the royal line. I am definitely going to look up the books you mentioned. If you can find a good biography of Katherine it is worth reading. She survived the plague, was a handmaiden of John’s first wife Blanch, her sister, Phillipa, was the wife of Chaucer.

Must be good, as I remember so much of it. Admit I’ve read it more than once! I will be glad to send author’s name if you are interested.

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

Oznell — Mon, 07 Jan 2019 00:41:45 GMT

Oh, yes, I would be interested, @Drythe. Cantor talks about Swinford too (or Swynford-- the spelling then was so fluid!) and sounds like an amazing story!

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

lovescats — Mon, 07 Jan 2019 02:12:14 GMT

it's tempting to order those books off of amazon but I don't need anything else to read right now.

I've never had any problems ordering used books off of Amazon and it looks like there are some good bargains for Norman Cantor's books

Re: FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THE MEDIEVAL WORLD...

Free2be — Mon, 07 Jan 2019 03:50:20 GMT

Thanks for the lead to Cantor. I have a variety of books about life in medieval times and saved them all after recently culling my book collection. Always fascinating to learn what they knew.