topic Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years in Community Chat

Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Moonchilde — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 22:44:47 GMT

Clothes sizing seems to be a see-saw at least through the last quarter of the 20th C to now. Designers and manufacturers periodically change the measurements that constitute a given size, or whether that size is considered ‘plus’ or not.

In the 60s and 70s I had to buy pants at a Tall shop. Today my height is considered unremarkable and sometimes Average is too long in some brands. Also during that time period I was considered on the thin side. My height/weight ratio was spot on, and I wore a 12 or 14.

As years passed and they started tinkering with sizes, my 12 or 14 dropped to a 10 based on height and weight. 3X became 2X, etc.

These days it seems a bit schizophrenic. 5’9 and 5’10” models wearing XS or 2 (and not anorexic thin), but on the other end, what was once an XL can now be a 2X, what was a 3X is now a 4X. I know some of it is because companies often charge more for larger sizes. Now many places charge extra for the XL that’s always been considered a normal Misses size.

We all know about vanity sizing. I’m puzzled as to why a mfg decides to tell someone who hasn’t changed weight or clothing size for years that they are now suddenly a size larger. WT*?

Ten years ago, I lost 65 lbs. At that time I went from a 3X to a L/XL within 6 mos. These days, I started at approx the same weight as the first time and have lost 40 lbs - and have not quite lost even one single size yet! That’s crazy. Not to mention frustrating.

Do you ever feel like WHAT are they doing? Labeling sizes smaller I get - it’s what most everyone would want. But deciding to label a size larger? That doesn’t make sense in light of the fact that “normal” is larger now than it’s been for 100 years.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

DiAnne — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 22:54:39 GMT

I think the sizes have gotten much larger. I wear the same numerical size I did in high school but I am 30 pounds heavier. I had not even heard of size 0 at that time.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

chrystaltree — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 22:56:52 GMT

It's true sizing has changed over the decades and I would like to see universal sizing like they have in Europe and the UK but that will never happen here. Sizing is one reason why I shop almost exclusively online now, I have access to size charts and I use them. It is what it is.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

grandma r — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 22:57:27 GMT

I think the main issue is where the garments are made. The people in many Asian countries are smaller than Americans. Some brands use fit models for each size, but, some don't. I've noticed that dept store clothing seems to run smaller than QVC sizing, especially tops. With the exception of high end stores, quality is lacking, regardless of price point.

And, perhaps some brands on QVC use different fit guidelines. I've recently heard a few vendors say "size down" on certain items.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Moonchilde — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 23:12:11 GMT

@grandma r wrote:
I think the main issue is where the garments are made. The people in many Asian countries are smaller than Americans. Some brands use fit models for each size, but, some don't. I've noticed that dept store clothing seems to run smaller than QVC sizing, especially tops. With the exception of high end stores, quality is lacking, regardless of price point.

And, perhaps some brands on QVC use different fit guidelines. I've recently heard a few vendors say "size down" on certain items.

QVC clothing in general has always been known to run large; in some lines it might even be 2 sizes.

I have found it to be true that inexpensive clothing is always too small because it is modeled on Asian bodies. But not in a store like Macy’s or any store with well-known major labels. The cheaper it is, the smaller it is.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

cherry — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 23:15:51 GMT

I think there is a lot of truth about where clothing is made. I just got some Halston shoes that were so small I couldn't wear them and I take a size 5! I could hardly stand to wear them they were so tight.

Who in the world would think a 5 would be too small for me? Surely not me. It also depends on the style. I can't go by size alone, I need to look at the garment fit sizes. Sometimes they can be all over the place. It's not unusual to have to size up or down, for most people.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Carmie — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 04:57:30 GMT

@grandma r wrote:
I think the main issue is where the garments are made. The people in many Asian countries are smaller than Americans. Some brands use fit models for each size, but, some don't. I've noticed that dept store clothing seems to run smaller than QVC sizing, especially tops. With the exception of high end stores, quality is lacking, regardless of price point.

And, perhaps some brands on QVC use different fit guidelines. I've recently heard a few vendors say "size down" on certain items.

I agree with you. When I was in Vietnam, we were invited to see a fashion show at a dress shop. I really didn’t want to go, but ended up being shamed into it.

The clothing was so, so small that I and most of the western women who were with me couldn’t fit into it. I ended up buying a silk wrap robe in an XXL. They only had one that fit me. I am 5’1” tall and weighed about 125 at the time. I usually wear a 10 petite. I am busty and have a booty.

The first thing I do when I get new clothing is cut out the size tag. If the size, is printed on, I use a marker to block it out. As long as it fits me, I don’t want to worry about the size.

Western women also have problems buying shoes in Asia. The clerks in the stores actually laugh at “our” big feet. I was okay in that area. I have small feet.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

sensibleshoppingsoothes — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:28:10 GMT

In 1930's movies they would refer to a sizze 12 as something to aspire to. (I'm old enough to remember.)

But I hope you're not discouraged. You lost the weight, and it's a great achievement

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Moonchilde — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:32:33 GMT

@cherry wrote:
I think there is a lot of truth about where clothing is made. I just got some Halston shoes that were so small I couldn't wear them and I take a size 5! I could hardly stand to wear them they were so tight.

Who in the world would think a 5 would be too small for me? Surely not me. It also depends on the style. I can't go by size alone, I need to look at the garment fit sizes. Sometimes they can be all over the place. It's not unusual to have to size up or down, for most people.

This has always been the case in a relatively minor way. Many of us, all our lives, know we need to size up or down in specific lines, based on our own bodies. But at the same time, it’s never been the norm. We have sizes - I know what size I wear most of the time. I don’t go shopping thinking I wonder what my size is.

But for me, these days, it’s getting to be that more and more people need to try something on in order to know if it fits, rather than all the years people have been able to say they can buy a size 10 off the rack. It’s true less now.

I could see manufacturers deciding to downsize by number and measurement if statistics showed that American women are getting smaller - shorter, thinner - but that’s not the case, in fact, the opposite is the case and has been for decades. Telling someone they’re bigger than they are just doesn’t seem like good business sense to me - making people feel negative about themselves without much purpose.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

summerwind — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:38:30 GMT

In preparing to move recently, I came across an old (around 25 years ago, just had had my second child) pair of LandsEnd jeans, size 18. They fit if I really suck it in. I currently wear Medium in D&C.

My ex was feeling pretty good about still wearing a 30" waist, even tho he'd gained 30 lbs or so over the years. His Dr. said, look again, 30" waist in mens' wear is actually 32". They even do it to men now!

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Hippiified — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:39:09 GMT

@sensibleshoppingsoothes wrote:
In 1930's movies they would refer to a sizze 12 as something to aspire to. (I'm old enough to remember.)
But I hope you're not discouraged. You lost the weight, and it's a great achievement

@sensibleshoppingsoothes

Very nice of you! And Welcome!

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

puttypiesmom — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:44:26 GMT

Many Asian Americans have the same problem with obesity as other Americans do. Our food portions are way too big.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

grandma r — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:44:59 GMT

I stopped even shopping at Macy's about 1 1/2 yrs ago. I was looking for a gown and what they had were poorly made but cost hundreds. I even ordered 2 online to see if that would help. It didn't. I ordered 2 dresses in exactly the same size. One was 4 1/4in longer than the other and the jacket was ripped!!!! When I returned them, and showed the sales clerk the rip, she said "you could fix that". A gown that cost hundreds of dollars and arrives ripped in unacceptable!!! And, the sizes were not consistent. No wonder so many stores are closing!

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

shoekitty — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:53:23 GMT

I worked in a museum for years. You look at a 12 from 1966, and the whole structure is different. Waist smaller, more fitted bodice, the shoulders are narrower, and the armholes are smaller!!! We had clothing dating from days where all clothing was homemade or tailored. Then early store bought clothing did not have sizing, but went by waist. In the 1940's store clothing was smaller than late 1950's. The clothing sizes dramatically changed when standard sizing was abandoned in the early 1990's. There was a world standard by which all clothing was made to fit. A size 12 in US, was the same size as other countries, but they called it their metrics, or whatever. All clothing in US was a strict measurement for waist, bust, hips, arm length, etc. when this standard was abandoned, it was to each their own. Each designer basically has their own sizing, based on their own consumer base, if a designer doesnt want anyone over a size 10 wearing their clothes, they base the sizing even smaller. So that 10, is really an 8. Hard to explain, but they have a method to their madness. I know women who will not look at clothing that is larger than the think they are, lol. My Mom is one. Omg, we take labels out, lie to her do what we have to, but she will close the box on a gift if she sees the label a 1x....which she can wear sometimes if the xl runs small. So some designers have gone to vanity sizing.

also, I think as humans progress, become healthier size has changed. Womens feet are larger, the waist is a bit larger, and our height is taller by an inch, compared to 1910 woman. Throwing those corsets, waist cinches out the window, and squeezing into shoes too small is not a fixation as it once was.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Bird mama — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 00:53:06 GMT

For me, the cut of clothing, pants in particular have changed and not for the better. I have a waist and I've noticed over the years that pants are cut wider around the waist and it's hard for me to find the goldilocks pant.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

happycat — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 01:16:53 GMT

Yes, I feel like "what are they doing" all the time. There was a time when if I was ordering something online, or buying in a store, I could order a Large and most of the time that Large was going to fit. Not now. Now, if I order online and look at the sizing chart, some say I need a medium, some are large and some are extra large..... I have yet to order a medium though.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

september — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 01:28:29 GMT

@DiAnne wrote:
I think the sizes have gotten much larger. I wear the same numerical size I did in high school but I am 30 pounds heavier. I had not even heard of size 0 at that time.

I agree. I'm about 15 pounds heavier than I was in high school, and wear a smaller size now.

It used to be hard to find anything smaller than size 6 in many stores. I think a 6 in the past is a 4 today. 4 is 2. Don't know about 0....can't wear that, but maybe my daughter can!

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

DiAnne — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 04:50:26 GMT

@Moonchilde wrote:
@grandma r wrote:
I think the main issue is where the garments are made. The people in many Asian countries are smaller than Americans. Some brands use fit models for each size, but, some don't. I've noticed that dept store clothing seems to run smaller than QVC sizing, especially tops. With the exception of high end stores, quality is lacking, regardless of price point.

And, perhaps some brands on QVC use different fit guidelines. I've recently heard a few vendors say "size down" on certain items.

QVC clothing in general has always been known to run large; in some lines it might even be 2 sizes.

I have found it to be true that inexpensive clothing is always too small because it is modeled on Asian bodies. But not in a store like Macy’s or any store with well-known major labels. The cheaper it is, the smaller it is.

@Moonchilde

I have to really be careful when I shop online elsewhere because QVC is really into vanity sizing. Every once in a while I will forget and end up with jeans I cannot zip or a shirt I cannot button!

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

Moonchilde — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 05:34:05 GMT

@september wrote:
@DiAnne wrote:
I think the sizes have gotten much larger. I wear the same numerical size I did in high school but I am 30 pounds heavier. I had not even heard of size 0 at that time.
I agree. I'm about 15 pounds heavier than I was in high school, and wear a smaller size now.

It used to be hard to find anything smaller than size 6 in many stores. I think a 6 in the past is a 4 today. 4 is 2. Don't know about 0....can't wear that, but maybe my daughter can!

I think there’s been a split somewhere in the middle. Sizes do go very small now - xxs and 0 - but the decision as to what is considered small, average and plus is artificially manipulated for the ends of the mfg and retailers. It’s the industry re-labeling 10-12 as Large and a 16 as a Plus size, when not that many years ago size 16 and even 18 were found in the Misses area and weren’t considered Plus.

They’ve (relatively) newly created tiny petite, then there is average and plus. But since they had to create xxs/0 out of thin air, everything else needed to be shifted. So if a 4 or a 6 is really desirable, an 8 or a 10 will be just okay, and anything over a 10 today is considered Large in many lines with many designers who do not want their customers to be over a size 10. Google “Abercrombie & Fitch hates fat women” and read the many articles.

Since this has begun to happen with other designers as well, it’s sending out a message that size 10 is at the very upper limits of normal, size 20+ is beyond the pale, and 12-18 ladies are fat - just less fat than those who must buy their clothes in a specialty store or dept. it’s made small women smaller and large women larger, and it’s arbitrary and artificial. And weird.

Re: Clothing Sizes Change Over the Years

CelticCrafter — Mon, 15 Jan 2018 10:50:55 GMT

If they continue, those of us that do wear smaller sizes will be reduced to rags because we can't find anything that fits unless we want to shop in the childrens department.