topic Re: Sundowning in Wellness

Sundowning

CatsyCline — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 20:28:15 GMT

Wondering about Sundowning I have been staying with my mother at her home for a few weeks now. a home she can no longer maintain. Mom is 91 and cannot hear even with her hearing aides so she's been leaving them out. She cannot be alone. it is very trying having to holler and repeat words to her umpteen times. she cleans and tidies all day then accuses me of not helping. also accuses "someone" of taking some possession of hers.

i believe she is having signs of "sundowning" she is very fixated on the household trash and what is to be done with it. the recyclables get stored in the garage and when thers a small pile i take them to the transefr station. the food scraps like chix bones , veggi scraps etc she wants thrown into the yrd. i go around and around with her but she insists scraps feed hungry varmints. NO disposer NO dishwsher NO microwave, air fryr slow cooker she never wanted conveniences.

Late in the day she will come in and fish around in the trash to see what i left in there, pick through it gets irate. last nite it was chicken drippings i put in a to-go soup container in the trash i covered with paper towel yet she found it. and yes she checks to see that the scraps are out there.

she goes in her room and sits looking at her clothing items again late day. today she decided to prepare Shrimp Scampi but left the shrimp out on the counter al day then decided to mix up a cake without cleaning her hands counters or utensils. she did this from scratch and the batter looked like mud. yesterday she washed chicken tenders and put the used paper towels and chicken pkg in the dish drainer leaving the alrready clean dishes in the drainer! i cleaned it w bleach

i will have list her home. another thing that has caused friction between us but it is out of her realm now to care for. Her housekeeper quit because she was not following Covid guidelines.

Re: Sundowning

Nonametoday — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 20:48:54 GMT

@CatsyCline wrote:
Wondering about Sundowning I have been staying with my mother at her home for a few weeks now. a home she can no longer maintain. Mom is 91 and cannot hear even with her hearing aides so she's been leaving them out. She cannot be alone. it is very trying having to holler and repeat words to her umpteen times. she cleans and tidies all day then accuses me of not helping. also accuses "someone" of taking some possession of hers.

i believe she is having signs of "sundowning" she is very fixated on the household trash and what is to be done with it. the recyclables get stored in the garage and when thers a small pile i take them to the transefr station. the food scraps like chix bones , veggi scraps etc she wants thrown into the yrd. i go around and around with her but she insists scraps feed hungry varmints. NO disposer NO dishwsher NO microwave, air fryr slow cooker she never wanted conveniences.

Late in the day she will come in and fish around in the trash to see what i left in there, pick through it gets irate. last nite it was chicken drippings i put in a to-go soup container in the trash i covered with paper towel yet she found it. and yes she checks to see that the scraps are out there.

she goes in her room and sits looking at her clothing items again late day. today she decided to prepare Shrimp Scampi but left the shrimp out on the counter al day then decided to mix up a cake without cleaning her hands counters or utensils. she did this from scratch and the batter looked like mud. yesterday she washed chicken tenders and put the used paper towels and chicken pkg in the dish drainer leaving the alrready clean dishes in the drainer! i cleaned it w bleach

i will have list her home. another thing that has caused friction between us but it is out of her realm now to care for. Her housekeeper quit because she was not following Covid guidelines.

@CatsyCline

Please ask your church or other civic organizations about support groups for caregivers of dementia patients. I could not answer your questions here but in a support group for caregivers of demented and Alzheimer's patients (your mother has dementia of which sundowning is just one form or a part of several forms). I have a medical background and have worked with many patients, many elderly but until I became the caregiver of a dementia patient, I had no idea what they went through on a day-to-day basis (and yes, my husband is deaf, because he has lost all his hearing and we have been through many thousands of dollars in hearing aids. (Finally, he was approved for cochlear implants which did not work out as it requires patience). Dementia patients have no patience. You must but you need to seek help for yourself. Nobody can help you like these support groups. Trust me. It was the best thing I ever did. Somebody is going to have your exact problem and there will be professionals there to help you.

Re: Sundowning

Puppy Lips — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 20:56:19 GMT

I am so sorry you are going through this. It must be awful. As of August of this year, our 4 parents are now all deceased, and thankfully, none of them had dementia. I hope that does not happen to either of us as I would hate for our children to have to deal with us in that sort of condition.

Please reach out for help as has been suggested. Good Luck to you and you are a wonderful daughter to be there helping her out.

Re: Sundowning

RedTop — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 21:03:15 GMT

@CatsyCline,

You didn't mention any diagnosis for your mother, but I am familiar with the aging issues you've mentioned, thru several family members in advanced stages of dementia.

As you can see, your mother has reached the stage of not being able to live alone, or be safe in her environment without your watchful eyes. She has created an unsafe environment by throwing food scraps outside to draw a variety of unwanted animals near her house, and she is not functioning at a safe level inside the house with her poor personal habits and unsafe food handling. If she were to be evaluated in her home, the decision would be that she is not safe there without 24/7 care.

Fixating and obsessiveness are big signs of late stage cognitive brain changes.

My grandmother developed sundowners in the personal care home, and her symptoms were more along the lines of extreme anxiety, confusion, and total disruption as soon as it started getting dark. She was combative, would scream and yell uncontrollably, and staff would have to isolate her in her room and sedate her to get thru it, before she created chaos with all the residents.

I send you best wishes and prayers of strength, as you are certainly dealing with a challenging situation, but you MUST ensure your mothers safety in the decisions you will soon have to make.

Re: Sundowning

BluestarFL — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 21:19:43 GMT

Definitely reach out to a support group and respit care. That was a great suggestion. I went through this with my Mom, and it was the hardest thing I've ever done. Being able to connect with others who experienced this same situation really helped me get through it. Just knowing you were not alone and that others feel like you do, was a huge relief to me since I felt I was the only one going through this very difficult journey. I had no family to help me - just me.... it was rough....

Re: Sundowning

FancyPhillyshopper — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 21:31:39 GMT

So sorry to hear about all the challenges you are having with your mother. Sundowning is only a part of the complex process of aging and dementia issues.

I have had both my father and my MIL go through this sad process, and the strain on caregivers is incredible.

Unfortunately, there is no cure and the situation will only worsen.

If you can afford it, perhaps you can contract with daily nursing or homegiver care to give yourself a break.

Yes, consider joining an online support group to get some tips and mental relief. Are there other family members who can provide support?

With all the Covid issues, nursing homes these days are more dangerous places, but perhaps after the vaccinations you can find a high quality location for her.

You have to have patience, a sense of humor, take nothing personally, and take over running the household. You should get Power of Attorney now so you are the legal decision maker.

My MIL also used to say off-the-wall things and SIL just agreed with everything--an easy way to resolve the hallucinations. Finally, purchase whatever appliances you need to run the household more effectively.

Best wishes.

Re: Sundowning

ECBG — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 21:39:25 GMT

I would contact your Council On Aging.

I'm so very sorry.

Re: Sundowning

AuntG — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 21:46:44 GMT

I can't help but feel bad for you. Another poster gave a more accurate description of what I consider sundowning, but no matter what you call it, there are cognitive problems that need to be addressed before you are driven crazy.

Re: Sundowning

Kachina624 — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 21:57:56 GMT

Every county in the US should have an office on aging, which could go by senior affairs or some other name. Call them for assistance on problems with old age or advice on handling situations. Should be in government pages of phone book.

Re: Sundowning

sann — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 22:25:17 GMT

I would contact her physician. He or she can best advise you.

Re: Sundowning

Mom2Dogs — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 22:44:19 GMT

@CatsyCline I am sorry this is happening, it is so sad to see our parents go down hill...I have no advice except for the trash...can you have two trash cans..one that she can 'go thru' and another one that she is unaware of to put the real trash in? Obviously it would have to be hidden from her.

Re: Sundowning

LonestarBabs — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 23:00:32 GMT

My mother has vascular dementia and I was her 24/7 caregiver for 5 exhausting years. I did get part-time help a few days per week from a wonderful senior care company but even that wasn't enough, and in April of this year I knew I had to make a change. I moved Mom into a lovely residential care home recommended by a local senior living referral expert (not a national chain that is allegedly localized) and it saved us both. It wasn't as expensive as a big assisted living facility and she is in a loving home of 6 residents with 2 full-time caregivers, nurses on staff who visit almost daily. Set in a neighborhood much like our own, it's homey and warm and Mom gets lots of attention. All staff is credentialed and the owner is a nurse with many years experience in a local hospital network whose passion for quality care really shows through.

Mom is at the point where she is Sundowning almost every day now but there are people who know how to handle it far better than I ever could.

Good luck. Ask for help. Don't be afraid. You need a village.

So much time spent "Mom-proofing" the house and trying to anticipate or react to every move/problem/issue was overwhelming at times. And I have a PhD in Gerontology!

Re: Sundowning

jlkz — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 23:04:43 GMT

@CatsyCline

Please take the great advice offered here: I learned so much from Alzheimer's resources when my mother and father went through different types of dementia.

My mother had Alzheimer's and my dad was going to handle it until the police got involved and wanted to talk to me, the eldest daughter.

It seems my mother was sundowning and got out of the house while my dad was in the bathroom. In heavy Sunday afternoon traffic, she crossed two major roads looking for her mother who had passed over 20+ years earlier. Mom was early mid-80's at this time. A concerned fellow saw her behaving strangely in the Wawa parking lot and called the police as she got more agitated when he spoke to her. Meanwhile, dad was driving around looking for her: as he pulled in to his driveway, there were two police cars already there with my mom.

i succeeded in getting her into assisted living, but it was not the best model for her dementia as these folks were interspersed with the regular, normal population. Furthermore, they were constantly being moved from their apartment to the first floor for dining and the. To the 4th floor for " activities " and back again....all fitting into the small elevator and waiting and waiting.

Early on, she who was meek and rule following became highly combative: she would hit staff with her cane. When transferred to a wheelchair, she would ram the staff.

Twice she was put in the lockdown ward at the local hospital. That was when a chance encounter with the social worker at a nearby store changed everything for my mother. I got her into a memory assisted living facility where she became more like her old self until a nursing home was needed about 8 months later.

My dad had Lewy Body dementia which was very aggressive....he passed within two months.

The dementia world is filled with many types of issues. Please seek professionals and utilize the resources available. It will make your life and that of your loved one much easier. The exhausting physical, mental and emotional toll cannot be avoided. It is a journey we are called on take....but not alone.

My heart goes out to you and every person who is dealing with this sad situation.

Re: Sundowning

Sooner — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 23:03:01 GMT

@CatsyCline Please contact her doctors as soon as possible, and get professional help from local organizations. You need to get help to be sure legal matters are in hand--I assume you are paying bills and have legal access to her social security or any pensions. What charities do to bleed old people is criminal.

You need more than support groups for you, you need to get help to get her into a facility. At this point, she is a danger to you and to others. It is hard to accept, but it is something that can't be ignored or downplayed for the serious situation it is.

I am so sorry. I have dealt with this more than once, and I have some idea of the stress and frustration you suffer. Bless you for your concern for her.

Re: Sundowning

Deree — Thu, 17 Dec 2020 00:01:43 GMT

@mimosa I agree with @Sooner about the need to consult with her doctor. As difficult as it is to accept what is happening with your mother, please don't make the mistake I did in trying to take care of her yourself. It sounds like she needs more care than you would be able to provide. I suffered greatly because I thought I could handle it all by myself and I regret that decision.

It may be possible to have a nurse and social worker come to the house right away to evaluate your mother and make recommendations. A facility with round the clock care may be necessary.

Re: Sundowning

Anonymous032819 — Thu, 17 Dec 2020 01:53:20 GMT

@CatsyCline

I'm sorry that you are going through this, but Sundowning has to do with a specific time/part of the day, where the patient becomes more agitated, confused, restless.

Here's a good definition from the NIH.

https://www.nia.nih.gov/health/tips-coping-sundowning

For example, in the morning and early afternoon, they are fine, but as the sun goes down ( which is where the word 'Sundowning' comes from) they get more restless, are more easily upset, are more easily confused.

So if your mother is fussy in the morning, that isn't Sundowning.

But if she becomes more easily upset and confused and restless as the sun goes down, and at night, that's Sundowning.

Re: Sundowning

hckynut — Thu, 17 Dec 2020 03:00:58 GMT

@CatsyCline

I have never heard of "Sundowning", and I must be missing the purpose of this thread. If someone wants to enlighten me the purpose, I obviously am missing, I would appreciate it.

hckynut

Re: Sundowning

tarsmom — Thu, 17 Dec 2020 04:48:08 GMT

@hckynut wrote:
@CatsyCline

I have never heard of "Sundowning", and I must be missing the purpose of this thread. If someone wants to enlighten me the purpose, I obviously am missing, I would appreciate it.

hckynut

I am no medical expert but I did go through this with my mother who has since passed away. Around "sundown" their behavior changes and they become confused. Sometimes it's very apparent, and sometimes it's not. My mom had to have surgery at 92 for a stomach issue and the poor roommate in the hospital said "you much be Michelle" - your mom was calling for you all night long". Such a difficult time for all! As her only daughter and the baby of the family, most of her care and decisions fell on me. I'm sure someone with better medical knowledge could provide additional info on "sundowners".

Re: Sundowning

Nonametoday — Thu, 17 Dec 2020 05:32:51 GMT

Many elderly people (and some not so elderly) have sundowning from hospitalization or following surgery, but when it occurs frequently, there is an issue with dementia.

They become difficult or afraid near sundown or "crazy" sotospeak and I don't mean that in an ugly way. Even I get the crazies when I can't deal with things and I have what I call a "meltdown" and have to talk to someone. That is why it is so important to have the support of a caregiver group.

Your children do not understand. Your siblings do not understand. I do not understand. Your friends do not understand. Others here do not understand exactly. We all have some minor amount of caring and understanding but we have not sat down and allowed you to spill from your heart every iota and detial. Until we have walked in those shoes, we do not understand and offering advice about putting a person in a facility is not what anyone should be doing for this lady. She needs to make those decisions after thorough evaluations but having a power of attorney is a wonderful idea.

This precious lady needs to be in touch with others who share similar situations and decide, after discussing with others and after talking to professionals (and most support groups are sponsored by someone who has experience working with the elderly in a professional capacity), and many in the support group have worked with so many professionals and had such long-term care at home with their patient, that they have words of wisdom that nobody else could offer.

In my support group there is a lady whose middle-aged husband, at 50 years of age developed dementia, has had dementia for 18 years, is now terminal and she has been his caregiver all this time. She has the patience of Job. She was a realtor in her former life but now she can get up and speak on dementia and Alzheimer's as well or better than most professionals because she is intelligent, articulate and well-studied.

It is people like this that you need to be in touch with. Then there are others who had to put their spouses or parents in facilities where they were terribly mistreated and others whose patient found a great care facility. Many facilities that are recommended by doctors or other professionals and even government-funded facilities are close to that person's pocketbook or emotion. You need to hear from many, many people before choosing something like that.

You just need to get into a group and let those who have walked in your shoes and those of her medical care professionals help you work this out. Do not try to make hasty decisions before you have spoken with others who have lived it and professionals who can offer the right kind of care and advice.

Re: Sundowning

Sooner — Thu, 17 Dec 2020 06:54:08 GMT

@hckynut wrote:
@CatsyCline

I have never heard of "Sundowning", and I must be missing the purpose of this thread. If someone wants to enlighten me the purpose, I obviously am missing, I would appreciate it.

hckynut

@hckynut Sundowners is when people become more fearful and exhibit more signs of distress and dementia as the day gets darker. I have watched it happen to three relatives.

They often stay up all night and roam the house. You can put away all the knives and other dangerous things, but some of them will go all around the house turning on gas stoves, turning on lights, turning the heat off, trying to leave the house or finding car keys, or crying, angry or calling 911 with panic attacks. Some become very much a danger to themselves or anyone else in the house.

The above are examples of what I have seen, also seeing things that aren't there such as snakes in the house, etc. I am not giving you medical answers or descriptions, but simply speaking to you about my personal experiences.

The problem with in-home care at this point is that people aren't usually able to provide 24-hour comfort, care and attentiveness. It is basically impossible.